Guillemot/Thrustmaster Ferrari FF Wheel - A Short Review

Bruce, Here ya Go. A couple of weeks ago my beloved, faithfull ACT labs Force RS gave up and I had to get anotehr wheel. As there were/are no ACT Labs here in the UK I bought the above wheel and promised one or two guys here that I'd pst my thoughts on it once I'd had time to get to know it. Apols for the line wraps, Agent seems to do that, originally typred as email. So here goes : Guillemot/Thustmaster Ferrari FF Wheel. I'd heard 2 or 3 bad points about this wheel before I got it. 1) Poor Clamping Mechanism 2) Flimsy Gear Shift paddles 3) Mostly negative comments about the pedals. I was actually quite pleased with the clamping mechanism, it is pretty similar to the MS wheels which are regarded as having the best clamping mechanism in most articles. The gear paddles do feel a little flimsy although I believe they have been beefed up in later models, certainly I don't feel they are likely to break but the switching action is a little "mushy" compared to other wheels I've used. I can't comment too much about the pedals as I used some MS pedals with my ACT labs wheel and have kept these in use for the Ferrari wheel. Certainly they are not as good IMO as the MS pedals but quite usable. The strange thing about them is that the pedal plates themselves are hinged which feels very odd. A very nice feature that I've only tried in a very haphazard way is that the Ferrari pedal box can be stood on it's end, upside down and raised off the ground 2 or 3 inches and be made to operate as "normal" pedals (i.e. hinged at the top, rather than at the bottom. I think if I could make a sturdy unit with the pedals in this arrangement, fix the plates so as not to be hinged they would be very good and allow more precise control than the MS pedals (by virtue of them being hinged at the top. The wheel itself is smaller than the Act labs but feels very substantial. The grip is rubberised plastic which I found got sticky in use but after a few days this went away once the sheen had worn off. I should mention the little stick-shift on the right-hand side, I use it for looking left & right in GPL as I find it useless as a gear-shift (quite simply it is much too far forward). Whilst awaiting it's arrival I sought the views of users as to good core.ini settings. In all I tried 6-7 different settings, none of which I liked particularly. I read all the stuff at slotweak, all of which makes sense but it's not what I want from a wheel. All I really want to feel from the wheel is the level of front-wheel traction I have. I'm really not concerned about feeling the rumble strips, the armco/ other cars if I hit them. I also like to feel the lateral balance of the car which I find most of the setting gave me. What they didn't give however was this front-wheel grip feedback. In a real racecar you tend to mainly feel what the front wheels are doing via the wheel, the rear-wheels by the seat of your pants and your general senses. Anyway, I found the lower settings seemed to bring in this feel, so I went lower, to cut a long story short I ended up with exactly the same settings that I used for my ACT Labs. Perhaps this is not surprising as they both use IForce, but I have found wheels treat these signals differently. Anyway, here is what I have : allow_force_feedback = 1 force_feedback_latency = 0.002 force_feedback_damping = 2.000000 max_steering_torque = 200.000000 I have no Spring or damper Gain in Control panel and Overall Gain is set at 70%. I'm pretty sure it's the settings that Alison arrived at when she tested the ACT Labs and I'm sure being a real-life racer also, she was searching for the same feedback as I was. My only difficulty has been in getting used to using 2 paddles to change gear, one on the left, one on the right. Before that I used a single paddle on the ACT Labs which I would pull to c/up, push to c/down. I got used to the new way in an hour or two and was quite confident going into my first race. However, with the extra things to think about in a race situation I reverted back to old habits and made a real mess of my T1 downchanges. I was ok for the rest of the race and have been OK since. Overall I think the force feedback I am getting is as good as the Force RS, certainly in GPL. I would still like my flip-flop gearchange but can get by OK with this. The only worrying thing is the longevity of those paddles. Oh, there is one thing that is a problem for me. You cannot make very quick major steering changes with this wheel. i.e. VERY quick opposite lock. You run up against the internals, not sure what it is but it really drags. Not a huge issue in GPL (although it has meant the difference between saving it and losing it at least 4-5 times, once in a race). I'm wondering if this will cause me a problem in games such as Rallymasters, CMR2 etc. Incidentally, the wheel costs about �77 (prob $115-120) from software first in the UK. Maxx

Hi Maxx, nice review! I've just bought the wheel as well. I like it, one thing irritates me though: it doesn't register small movement very well in GPL. It is not deadzone related, because it reacts the same with some lock applied. How is this on your wheel? Maxx <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> > Bruce, > > Here ya Go. > > > A couple of weeks ago my beloved, faithfull ACT labs Force RS gave > up and I had to get anotehr wheel. As there were/are no ACT Labs here > in the UK I bought the above wheel and promised one or two guys > here that I'd pst my thoughts on it once I'd had time to get to know > it. > > Apols for the line wraps, Agent seems to do that, originally typred > as email. > > > So here goes : > > Guillemot/Thustmaster Ferrari FF Wheel. > > I'd heard 2 or 3 bad points about this wheel before I got it. > > 1) Poor Clamping Mechanism > 2) Flimsy Gear Shift paddles > 3) Mostly negative comments about the pedals. > > I was actually quite pleased with the clamping mechanism, it is pretty > similar > to the MS wheels which are regarded as having the best clamping > mechanism in > most articles. > > The gear paddles do feel a little flimsy although I believe they have > been > beefed up in later models, certainly I don't feel they are likely to > break > but the switching action is a little "mushy" compared to other wheels > I've > used. > > I can't comment too much about the pedals as I used some MS pedals > with my > ACT labs wheel and have kept these in use for the Ferrari wheel. > Certainly > they are not as good IMO as the MS pedals but quite usable. > > The strange thing about them is that the pedal plates themselves are > hinged > which feels very odd. > > A very nice feature that I've only tried in a very haphazard way is > that > the Ferrari pedal box can be stood on it's end, upside down and raised > off > the ground 2 or 3 inches and be made to operate as "normal" pedals > (i.e. > hinged at the top, rather than at the bottom. > > I think if I could make a sturdy unit with the pedals in this > arrangement, > fix the plates so as not to be hinged they would be very good and > allow > more precise control than the MS pedals (by virtue of them being > hinged at > the top. > > The wheel itself is smaller than the Act labs but feels very > substantial. > The grip is rubberised plastic which I found got sticky in use but > after a > few days this went away once the sheen had worn off. > > I should mention the little stick-shift on the right-hand side, I use > it for > looking left & right in GPL as I find it useless as a gear-shift > (quite > simply it is much too far forward). > > Whilst awaiting it's arrival I sought the views of users as to good > core.ini > settings. In all I tried 6-7 different settings, none of which I liked > particularly. I read all the stuff at slotweak, all of which makes > sense but > it's not what I want from a wheel. > > All I really want to feel from the wheel is the level of front-wheel > traction > I have. I'm really not concerned about feeling the rumble strips, the > armco/ > other cars if I hit them. I also like to feel the lateral balance of > the car > which I find most of the setting gave me. What they didn't give > however was > this front-wheel grip feedback. > > In a real racecar you tend to mainly feel what the front wheels are > doing > via the wheel, the rear-wheels by the seat of your pants and your > general > senses. > > Anyway, I found the lower settings seemed to bring in this feel, so I > went > lower, to cut a long story short I ended up with exactly the same > settings > that I used for my ACT Labs. Perhaps this is not surprising as they > both use > IForce, but I have found wheels treat these signals differently. > > Anyway, here is what I have : > > allow_force_feedback = 1 > force_feedback_latency = 0.002 > force_feedback_damping = 2.000000 > max_steering_torque = 200.000000 > > I have no Spring or damper Gain in Control panel and Overall Gain is > set at 70%. > > I'm pretty sure it's the settings that Alison arrived at when she > tested the ACT Labs > and I'm sure being a real-life racer also, she was searching for the > same feedback as I > was. > > My only difficulty has been in getting used to using 2 paddles to > change gear, one on > the left, one on the right. Before that I used a single paddle on the > ACT Labs which I > would pull to c/up, push to c/down. > > I got used to the new way in an hour or two and was quite confident > going into my first > race. However, with the extra things to think about in a race > situation I reverted back > to old habits and made a real mess of my T1 downchanges. I was ok for > the rest of the > race and have been OK since. > > Overall I think the force feedback I am getting is as good as the > Force RS, certainly > in GPL. I would still like my flip-flop gearchange but can get by OK > with this. The only > worrying thing is the longevity of those paddles. > > Oh, there is one thing that is a problem for me. You cannot make very > quick major steering > changes with this wheel. i.e. VERY quick opposite lock. You run up > against the internals, > not sure what it is but it really drags. Not a huge issue in GPL > (although it has meant > the difference between saving it and losing it at least 4-5 times, > once in a race). I'm > wondering if this will cause me a problem in games such as > Rallymasters, CMR2 etc. > > Incidentally, the wheel costs about �77 (prob $115-120) from software > first in the UK. > > Maxx

On Sun, 18 Feb 2001 23:19:56 +0100, "jhl" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Hi Maxx, >nice review! > >I've just bought the wheel as well. I like it, one thing irritates me >though: it doesn't register small movement very well in GPL. It is not >deadzone related, because it reacts the same with some lock applied. How is >this on your wheel?

I've not noticed anything particular in this regard. I do use DXDeadzone to set deadzone to 0% and am at 99% Linearity so I'm potentially removing most of the slack. I also tend to run 12:1 steering ratio so this might mask such things. Maxx

I've used dxtweak to set the deadzones to 0%, I also use almost full linearity, but it still is not as precise as a friends msff which I've used for a while. Well, maybe it has to run in a bit... anyway, I seem to get used to it, because I've set a PB at Mexico :) Maxx <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Sun, 18 Feb 2001 23:19:56 +0100, "jhl" > <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >Hi Maxx, > >nice review! > > > >I've just bought the wheel as well. I like it, one thing irritates me > >though: it doesn't register small movement very well in GPL. It is not > >deadzone related, because it reacts the same with some lock applied. How

is

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> >this on your wheel? > > I've not noticed anything particular in this regard. I do use > DXDeadzone to set deadzone to 0% and am at 99% Linearity so I'm > potentially removing most of the slack. I also tend to run 12:1 > steering ratio so this might mask such things. > > Maxx

Do you know if it'll run under Win2000? My MS FF won't, so I'm in the market for a new wheel. Thanks, John Maxx wrote:

Quoted text (158 lines)

> > Bruce, > > Here ya Go. > > A couple of weeks ago my beloved, faithfull ACT labs Force RS gave > up and I had to get anotehr wheel. As there were/are no ACT Labs here > in the UK I bought the above wheel and promised one or two guys > here that I'd pst my thoughts on it once I'd had time to get to know > it. > > Apols for the line wraps, Agent seems to do that, originally typred > as email. > > So here goes : > > Guillemot/Thustmaster Ferrari FF Wheel. > > I'd heard 2 or 3 bad points about this wheel before I got it. > > 1) Poor Clamping Mechanism > 2) Flimsy Gear Shift paddles > 3) Mostly negative comments about the pedals. > > I was actually quite pleased with the clamping mechanism, it is pretty > similar > to the MS wheels which are regarded as having the best clamping > mechanism in > most articles. > > The gear paddles do feel a little flimsy although I believe they have > been > beefed up in later models, certainly I don't feel they are likely to > break > but the switching action is a little "mushy" compared to other wheels > I've > used. > > I can't comment too much about the pedals as I used some MS pedals > with my > ACT labs wheel and have kept these in use for the Ferrari wheel. > Certainly > they are not as good IMO as the MS pedals but quite usable. > > The strange thing about them is that the pedal plates themselves are > hinged > which feels very odd. > > A very nice feature that I've only tried in a very haphazard way is > that > the Ferrari pedal box can be stood on it's end, upside down and raised > off > the ground 2 or 3 inches and be made to operate as "normal" pedals > (i.e. > hinged at the top, rather than at the bottom. > > I think if I could make a sturdy unit with the pedals in this > arrangement, > fix the plates so as not to be hinged they would be very good and > allow > more precise control than the MS pedals (by virtue of them being > hinged at > the top. > > The wheel itself is smaller than the Act labs but feels very > substantial. > The grip is rubberised plastic which I found got sticky in use but > after a > few days this went away once the sheen had worn off. > > I should mention the little stick-shift on the right-hand side, I use > it for > looking left & right in GPL as I find it useless as a gear-shift > (quite > simply it is much too far forward). > > Whilst awaiting it's arrival I sought the views of users as to good > core.ini > settings. In all I tried 6-7 different settings, none of which I liked > particularly. I read all the stuff at slotweak, all of which makes > sense but > it's not what I want from a wheel. > > All I really want to feel from the wheel is the level of front-wheel > traction > I have. I'm really not concerned about feeling the rumble strips, the > armco/ > other cars if I hit them. I also like to feel the lateral balance of > the car > which I find most of the setting gave me. What they didn't give > however was > this front-wheel grip feedback. > > In a real racecar you tend to mainly feel what the front wheels are > doing > via the wheel, the rear-wheels by the seat of your pants and your > general > senses. > > Anyway, I found the lower settings seemed to bring in this feel, so I > went > lower, to cut a long story short I ended up with exactly the same > settings > that I used for my ACT Labs. Perhaps this is not surprising as they > both use > IForce, but I have found wheels treat these signals differently. > > Anyway, here is what I have : > > allow_force_feedback = 1 > force_feedback_latency = 0.002 > force_feedback_damping = 2.000000 > max_steering_torque = 200.000000 > > I have no Spring or damper Gain in Control panel and Overall Gain is > set at 70%. > > I'm pretty sure it's the settings that Alison arrived at when she > tested the ACT Labs > and I'm sure being a real-life racer also, she was searching for the > same feedback as I > was. > > My only difficulty has been in getting used to using 2 paddles to > change gear, one on > the left, one on the right. Before that I used a single paddle on the > ACT Labs which I > would pull to c/up, push to c/down. > > I got used to the new way in an hour or two and was quite confident > going into my first > race. However, with the extra things to think about in a race > situation I reverted back > to old habits and made a real mess of my T1 downchanges. I was ok for > the rest of the > race and have been OK since. > > Overall I think the force feedback I am getting is as good as the > Force RS, certainly > in GPL. I would still like my flip-flop gearchange but can get by OK > with this. The only > worrying thing is the longevity of those paddles. > > Oh, there is one thing that is a problem for me. You cannot make very > quick major steering > changes with this wheel. i.e. VERY quick opposite lock. You run up > against the internals, > not sure what it is but it really drags. Not a huge issue in GPL > (although it has meant > the difference between saving it and losing it at least 4-5 times, > once in a race). I'm > wondering if this will cause me a problem in games such as > Rallymasters, CMR2 etc. > > Incidentally, the wheel costs about �77 (prob $115-120) from software > first in the UK. > > Maxx

Although Win2k isn't mentioned in the manual or on the box, Win2k drivers can be found on the installation cd. You can also find them on their website. So I guess it should work. JH John Zumsteg <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Do you know if it'll run under Win2000? My MS FF won't, so I'm in the > market for a new wheel. > > Thanks, > John >

It works-ish: 1. NFS PU - just feel collisions, no engine/road forces (hunting hard for the solution) 2. cmr2 - Doesn't recognise it as having FF. I sussed a work-around by copying the "controller.rcf" from the "<installdir>\configuration" folder off a W98 install with the wheel & now seems ok. 3. MM2 (I know it's not a real auto sim) - I think it feels the same as with W98, but I haven't played it much. "John Zumsteg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Do you know if it'll run under Win2000? My MS FF won't, so I'm in the > market for a new wheel. > > Thanks, > John >-- Remove guts to reply