In article <[email hidden]>,
Maxx <[email hidden]> writes:
Just went and looked at my own "Best Times" chart and found very few T laps at
all. As a matter of fact, at four of the eleven tracks, I have no training
laps at all! Most of my best laps are race laps because that's how I practice.
I'm not interested in how fast I can go, I concentrate on finishing well. I
practice by running races against the AI starting dead last. This gives me
practice running with other cars.
A similar discussion came up before GPL Rank was released to the public where
some thought it should be based upon replays only, eliminating warps and .ini
hacking. My complaint was that I have no replays to submit! I have one or two
spectacular crashes, and the full replay from a few league races where I
performed well, but I NEVER save a replay. Most of us probably do, but I'm
sure I'm not alone.
Don McCorkle
Good post... seconded.
Jan.
=---
Woodie 83 wrote...
> <snip>
> Just went and looked at my own "Best Times" chart and found very few Tlaps at
> all. As a matter of fact, at four of the eleven tracks, I have notraining
> laps at all! Most of my best laps are race laps because that's how Ipractice.
> I'm not interested in how fast I can go, I concentrate on finishing well.I
> practice by running races against the AI starting dead last. This givesme
> practice running with other cars.
>
> A similar discussion came up before GPL Rank was released to the publicwhere
> some thought it should be based upon replays only, eliminating warps and.ini
> hacking. My complaint was that I have no replays to submit! I have oneor two
> spectacular crashes, and the full replay from a few league races where I
> performed well, but I NEVER save a replay. Most of us probably do, butI'm
> sure I'm not alone.
>
>
> Don McCorkle
>
I set a PB at Monza tonight and was checking out the laptimes at GPLRank after
submitting my ini file. I see the fastest 6 times shown for Monza ALL beat the
world record shown at Shubi's site. I just know that if I had me a time like
that, I'd want my name at Shubi's.
World record
1 120 Leonardo Grandis 1:26.43 02.09.00 Wheel Replay Setup Lotus
GPLRank
1 Matt Knopp (KNOPPY) England Eagle 01:25.78 R
2 DOUGLAS THOMSON Scotland Lotus 01:25.99 T
3 Risto Junnilainen Finland Lotus 01:26.08 R
4 Erick Thomas United States Eagle 01:26.10 T
5 Javier Marante Spain Eagle 01:26.36 T
6 Mitja Bonca Slovenia Lotus 01:26.41 P
[email hidden] (HainesLC) wrote in
<[email hidden]>:
This is an ongoing problem, and Monza is by far the worst track for
this. Some of these guys are very capable drivers who very well may
have beaten the record, with others it's unlikely. It's a judgement
call that we'd rather not make. The GPLRank WR rule was brought in to
encourage people to police themselves, we really don't want to be
doing it.
--
Don Scurlock
Vancouver,B.C.
GPLRank -5.09
Come see how you rank, at the GPLRank site
http://gplrank.ringlord.com/
Quoted text (16 lines)
>I set a PB at Monza tonight and was checking out the laptimes at >GPLRank after submitting my ini file. I see the fastest 6 times >shown for Monza ALL beat the world record shown at Shubi's site. I >just know that if I had me a time like that, I'd want my name at >Shubi's. > >World record >1 120 Leonardo Grandis 1:26.43 02.09.00 Wheel Replay Setup Lotus > >GPLRank >1 Matt Knopp (KNOPPY) England Eagle 01:25.78 R >2 DOUGLAS THOMSON Scotland Lotus 01:25.99 T >3 Risto Junnilainen Finland Lotus 01:26.08 R >4 Erick Thomas United States Eagle 01:26.10 T >5 Javier Marante Spain Eagle 01:26.36 T >6 Mitja Bonca Slovenia Lotus 01:26.41 PCould be accidental rail rides, could be just changing the player.ini to
make it look like they have a WR, and a few of those (the R ones) could have
been done with a draft.
JB
"HainesLC" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> I set a PB at Monza tonight and was checking out the laptimes at GPLRankafter
> submitting my ini file. I see the fastest 6 times shown for Monza ALL beatthe
> world record shown at Shubi's site. I just know that if I had me a timelike
Quoted text (14 lines)
> that, I'd want my name at Shubi's. > > World record > 1 120 Leonardo Grandis 1:26.43 02.09.00 Wheel Replay Setup Lotus > > GPLRank > 1 Matt Knopp (KNOPPY) England Eagle 01:25.78 R > 2 DOUGLAS THOMSON Scotland Lotus 01:25.99 T > 3 Risto Junnilainen Finland Lotus 01:26.08 R > 4 Erick Thomas United States Eagle 01:26.10 T > 5 Javier Marante Spain Eagle 01:26.36 T > 6 Mitja Bonca Slovenia Lotus 01:26.41 P > >Very good point
Though cheating is likely
Thanks,
Alex
Wosco <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:NacG5.3575$[email hidden]...
> Could be accidental rail rides, could be just changing the player.ini to
> make it look like they have a WR, and a few of those (the R ones) couldhave
beat
Quoted text (9 lines)
> been done with a draft. > > JB > > "HainesLC" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > I set a PB at Monza tonight and was checking out the laptimes at GPLRank > after > > submitting my ini file. I see the fastest 6 times shown for Monza ALLQuoted text (19 lines)
> the > > world record shown at Shubi's site. I just know that if I had me a time > like > > that, I'd want my name at Shubi's. > > > > World record > > 1 120 Leonardo Grandis 1:26.43 02.09.00 Wheel Replay Setup Lotus > > > > GPLRank > > 1 Matt Knopp (KNOPPY) England Eagle 01:25.78 R > > 2 DOUGLAS THOMSON Scotland Lotus 01:25.99 T > > 3 Risto Junnilainen Finland Lotus 01:26.08 R > > 4 Erick Thomas United States Eagle 01:26.10 T > > 5 Javier Marante Spain Eagle 01:26.36 T > > 6 Mitja Bonca Slovenia Lotus 01:26.41 P > > > > > >
I would have thought that GPLRank would only count Training
laps, as Practice and Race Laps could benefit from drafting and/
or warping effects.
Out of interest I just took a look at a few "Their Best Laps" and
very often it seems that a Race lap is the fastest and sometimes
by quite some margin.
I think it pretty rare (although by no means impossible) that someone
can go significantly quicker in a race than they can in Training (I
know there are probably some people who rarely go for hotlaps
in training mode and race a lot of the time - as indeed Schubi's
site does.
It's a difficult one, but every other laptime/stage time related
ranking site I've seen has worked on training/practice times
and specifically discounted race laps.
I'm not sure what others feel about this (i.e. altering GPLRank
to only rank based on training laps), I'm sure it would be very
controversial .. I feel a long thread coming on here ..
I think it's well worth discussing. To put myself on the spot it
would seem to me to be the right thing to do and I would "vote"
for a training lap only system.
Maxx
On Sun, 15 Oct 2000 06:31:09 GMT, "Wosco" <[email hidden]> wrote:
Quoted text (29 lines)
>Could be accidental rail rides, could be just changing the player.ini to >make it look like they have a WR, and a few of those (the R ones) could have >been done with a draft. > >JB > >"HainesLC" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> I set a PB at Monza tonight and was checking out the laptimes at GPLRank >after >> submitting my ini file. I see the fastest 6 times shown for Monza ALL beat >the >> world record shown at Shubi's site. I just know that if I had me a time >like >> that, I'd want my name at Shubi's. >> >> World record >> 1 120 Leonardo Grandis 1:26.43 02.09.00 Wheel Replay Setup Lotus >> >> GPLRank >> 1 Matt Knopp (KNOPPY) England Eagle 01:25.78 R >> 2 DOUGLAS THOMSON Scotland Lotus 01:25.99 T >> 3 Risto Junnilainen Finland Lotus 01:26.08 R >> 4 Erick Thomas United States Eagle 01:26.10 T >> 5 Javier Marante Spain Eagle 01:26.36 T >> 6 Mitja Bonca Slovenia Lotus 01:26.41 P >> >> >On Sun, 15 Oct 2000 13:51:51 +0100, Maxx <[email hidden]>
wrote:
The
" - as indeed Schubi's site does"
Should have been after ..
"It's a difficult one, but every other laptime/stage time related
ranking site I've seen has worked on training/practice times
and specifically discounted race laps."
sorry to confuse.
Maxx
The laptimes on gplrank are NOT controlled hotlaps. In other words they can
be racelaps with drafting and so on.
HainesLC <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> I set a PB at Monza tonight and was checking out the laptimes at GPLRankafter
> submitting my ini file. I see the fastest 6 times shown for Monza ALL beatthe
> world record shown at Shubi's site. I just know that if I had me a timelike
Quoted text (14 lines)
> that, I'd want my name at Shubi's. > > World record > 1 120 Leonardo Grandis 1:26.43 02.09.00 Wheel Replay Setup Lotus > > GPLRank > 1 Matt Knopp (KNOPPY) England Eagle 01:25.78 R > 2 DOUGLAS THOMSON Scotland Lotus 01:25.99 T > 3 Risto Junnilainen Finland Lotus 01:26.08 R > 4 Erick Thomas United States Eagle 01:26.10 T > 5 Javier Marante Spain Eagle 01:26.36 T > 6 Mitja Bonca Slovenia Lotus 01:26.41 P > >If someone wants to fiddle their times on GPL Rank then there are lot
seasier ways then trying to get a draft on a race lap. Fortunatly it seems
most people in the rank realise without honesty it wouldn't work.
Chris
--
Simbok Racing
www.geocities.com/simbokza
Remove _your_clothes before replying
"Maxx" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
>
> I would have thought that GPLRank would only count Training
> laps, as Practice and Race Laps could benefit from drafting and/
> or warping effects.
<SNIP>
> I'm not sure what others feel about this (i.e. altering GPLRank
> to only rank based on training laps), I'm sure it would be very
> controversial .. I feel a long thread coming on here ..
>
> I think it's well worth discussing. To put myself on the spot it
> would seem to me to be the right thing to do and I would "vote"
> for a training lap only system.
>
> Maxx
>
> On Sun, 15 Oct 2000 06:31:09 GMT, "Wosco" <[email hidden]> wrote:
>
> >Could be accidental rail rides, could be just changing the player.ini to
> >make it look like they have a WR, and a few of those (the R ones) could
have
> >been done with a draft.
> >
> >JB
> >
> >"HainesLC" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
> >news:[email hidden]...
> >> I set a PB at Monza tonight and was checking out the laptimes at
GPLRank
> >after
> >> submitting my ini file. I see the fastest 6 times shown for Monza ALL
beat
> >the
> >> world record shown at Shubi's site. I just know that if I had me a time
> >like
> >> that, I'd want my name at Shubi's.
> >>
> >> World record
> >> 1 120 Leonardo Grandis 1:26.43 02.09.00 Wheel Replay Setup Lotus
> >>
> >> GPLRank
> >> 1 Matt Knopp (KNOPPY) England Eagle 01:25.78 R
> >> 2 DOUGLAS THOMSON Scotland Lotus 01:25.99 T
> >> 3 Risto Junnilainen Finland Lotus 01:26.08 R
> >> 4 Erick Thomas United States Eagle 01:26.10 T
> >> 5 Javier Marante Spain Eagle 01:26.36 T
> >> 6 Mitja Bonca Slovenia Lotus 01:26.41 P
> >>
> >>
> >
>
On 15 Oct 2000 15:30:43 GMT, [email hidden] (Woodie 83) wrote:
Don,
Sorry if this has been aired before, I've only had GPL about 5months
and didn't get on GPLRank until recently. I looked at a few more after
my post and did notice a couple where they had no test laps at all at
a particular track.
I guess we often think everyone runs GPL the same way, but this
is clearly not the case and as GPLRank was set up in this form, then
far be it for me to suggest a change.
I didn't actually know that it did count race laps, until I looked
following the earlier post, it just struck me as strange that it
would do that knowing that it's generally not done at the hotlap
type sites, for the reasons the earlier poster described.
Now I know GPLRank is not specifically a hotlap type site as
such and I think it's only relavant if you are really focusing on
position "in the charts" rather than your handicap rating.
On balance I think I'll withdraw my view on the site being changed,
it appears this would effect many more people than I'd at first
thought and as long as we all know how it works then that's
fine.
Maxx
Quoted text (16 lines)
>Just went and looked at my own "Best Times" chart and found very few T laps at >all. As a matter of fact, at four of the eleven tracks, I have no training >laps at all! Most of my best laps are race laps because that's how I practice. > I'm not interested in how fast I can go, I concentrate on finishing well. I >practice by running races against the AI starting dead last. This gives me >practice running with other cars. > >A similar discussion came up before GPL Rank was released to the public where >some thought it should be based upon replays only, eliminating warps and .ini >hacking. My complaint was that I have no replays to submit! I have one or two >spectacular crashes, and the full replay from a few league races where I >performed well, but I NEVER save a replay. Most of us probably do, but I'm >sure I'm not alone. > > >Don McCorkleIf people want to judge their best times, Schubi's is the best place and
that is all verified by replays. Other people (like me) hadly ever use
training mode any more and detest hotlapping, which will explain wht my lap
times are faster in a race than training. Most of my training times are at
least 12 months old. I sat leave GPL rank as it is, but have a facility to
reject laps within a certain percentage of the WR unless there is proof for
it.
--
Ian P
<email invalid due to spam>
Maxx <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> On Sun, 15 Oct 2000 13:51:51 +0100, Maxx <[email hidden]>
> wrote:
>
> The
> " - as indeed Schubi's site does"
>
> Should have been after ..
>
> "It's a difficult one, but every other laptime/stage time related
> ranking site I've seen has worked on training/practice times
> and specifically discounted race laps."
>
> sorry to confuse.
>
> Maxx
[email hidden] (Wosco) wrote in <NacG5.3575$[email hidden]>:
>Could be accidental rail rides,
Accidental? Hitting the rail is an accident, and it will slow you down. To get
a super lap time using the rails, you have to come into them at the proper
angle, totally off the racing line, and keep the throttle on ALL the way along
them, that is NOT an accident, and GPLRank specifically forbids using this
kiddy/arcade technique.
> a few of those (the R ones) could have been done with a draft.
I believe it's been shown that drafting is not a significant factor.
Maxx, we have been through the race/training debate. We don't want to limit
people to training only, for reasons that have been recently expressed. GPLRank
wasn't meant to be a closely judged competition. Schubi's does that
wonderfully, and is why we use it as the standard for the World Record Rule, a
rule we don't want to be applying to harshly, but which we must bring out when
the children get out of hand.
--
Don Scurlock
Vancouver,B.C.
GPLRank -5.09
Come see how you rank, at the GPLRank site
http://gplrank.ringlord.com/
Quoted text (27 lines)
> >JB > >"HainesLC" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> I set a PB at Monza tonight and was checking out the laptimes at GPLRank >after >> submitting my ini file. I see the fastest 6 times shown for Monza ALL beat >the >> world record shown at Shubi's site. I just know that if I had me a time >like >> that, I'd want my name at Shubi's. >> >> World record >> 1 120 Leonardo Grandis 1:26.43 02.09.00 Wheel Replay Setup Lotus >> >> GPLRank >> 1 Matt Knopp (KNOPPY) England Eagle 01:25.78 R >> 2 DOUGLAS THOMSON Scotland Lotus 01:25.99 T >> 3 Risto Junnilainen Finland Lotus 01:26.08 R >> 4 Erick Thomas United States Eagle 01:26.10 T >> 5 Javier Marante Spain Eagle 01:26.36 T >> 6 Mitja Bonca Slovenia Lotus 01:26.41 P >> >> > >well said.......cheats have no place in the world of GPL.
Greg Stewart
"HainesLC" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> I set a PB at Monza tonight and was checking out the laptimes at GPLRankafter
> submitting my ini file. I see the fastest 6 times shown for Monza ALL beatthe
> world record shown at Shubi's site. I just know that if I had me a timelike
Quoted text (14 lines)
> that, I'd want my name at Shubi's. > > World record > 1 120 Leonardo Grandis 1:26.43 02.09.00 Wheel Replay Setup Lotus > > GPLRank > 1 Matt Knopp (KNOPPY) England Eagle 01:25.78 R > 2 DOUGLAS THOMSON Scotland Lotus 01:25.99 T > 3 Risto Junnilainen Finland Lotus 01:26.08 R > 4 Erick Thomas United States Eagle 01:26.10 T > 5 Javier Marante Spain Eagle 01:26.36 T > 6 Mitja Bonca Slovenia Lotus 01:26.41 P > >i dont often post any bitchy grievences in RAS..but when ive spent countless
hours increasing my ability only to be beaten by a full second by some cheat
or person to lazy to alter a warp lap........i lose alot of respect for
certain individuals.
Cmon you fast dudes....quit the crap and do the lap !
regards
Greg Stewart
"gjs" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:KWdG5.1915$[email hidden]...
beat
Quoted text (8 lines)
> well said.......cheats have no place in the world of GPL. > > Greg Stewart > "HainesLC" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > I set a PB at Monza tonight and was checking out the laptimes at GPLRank > after > > submitting my ini file. I see the fastest 6 times shown for Monza ALLQuoted text (19 lines)
> the > > world record shown at Shubi's site. I just know that if I had me a time > like > > that, I'd want my name at Shubi's. > > > > World record > > 1 120 Leonardo Grandis 1:26.43 02.09.00 Wheel Replay Setup Lotus > > > > GPLRank > > 1 Matt Knopp (KNOPPY) England Eagle 01:25.78 R > > 2 DOUGLAS THOMSON Scotland Lotus 01:25.99 T > > 3 Risto Junnilainen Finland Lotus 01:26.08 R > > 4 Erick Thomas United States Eagle 01:26.10 T > > 5 Javier Marante Spain Eagle 01:26.36 T > > 6 Mitja Bonca Slovenia Lotus 01:26.41 P > > > > > >On Sun 15 Oct 2000 06:01:43p, Ian P wrote:
<snip>
>have a
>facility to reject laps within a certain percentage of the WR unless
>there is proof for it.<snip>
We're ahead of you there, Ian. This is already dealt with by the "WR rule",
which states that anyone going sub-WR has to provide a replay. People are
forever being emailed about suspiciously fast times, and in some cases
having their accounts deleted. I've done it myself (deleted an account, I
mean, not had a sub-WR time!)
--
David. (GPLRank handicap: -5.86)
The GPL Scrapyard - http://www.hillclimbfan.f2s.com
"After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, really" -
Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh.
On Sun 15 Oct 2000 07:31:09a, Wosco wrote:
>Could be accidental rail rides,
Nope. If you hit the rail accidentally, you get off the power and slow down
- and often damage the car in a race. To do a superfast railride, you have
to know exactly what you're doing, and keep the power down the whole way
around. In any case, railrides aren't allowed. Full stop.
> could be just changing the player.ini to
>make it look like they have a WR,
Which is pretty stupid, as there are enough GPLRank admins (even including
the ones who don't do much - <cough>) to notice pretty quickly and (if
necessary) delete an account. This is the advantage of having humans
running the shop - judgement can be exeercised in the way it can't easily
on an entirely automatic system.
> and a few of those (the R ones) could
>have been done with a draft.
...which is entirely acceptable under GPLRank rules. In any case, I've
found (somewhat to my surprise) that I'm often quicker in a race than
training - seeing another car looming in your mirrors is a powerful
incentive to go faster!
I draw a distinction between those (and there are some) who have uploaded
railriding/clock smashed times out of ignorance of the rules and those who
do it deliberately. The first category are merely lazy (rule one of
rankings sites: RTFFAQ!); for the second category I have nothing but
contempt. I improved my GPLRank by 0.18s this weekend, and I'm delighted.
To then see someone suddenly gain (eg) a minute in a few hours annoys the
hell out of me.
--
David. (GPLRank handicap: -5.86)
The GPL Scrapyard - http://www.hillclimbfan.f2s.com
"After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, really" -
Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh.
In that case GPL Rank is just fine as it is ;)
--
Ian P
<email invalid due to spam>
David Buttery <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> On Sun 15 Oct 2000 06:01:43p, Ian P wrote:
>
> <snip>
> >have a
> >facility to reject laps within a certain percentage of the WR unless
> >there is proof for it.
> <snip>
>
> We're ahead of you there, Ian. This is already dealt with by the "WR
rule",
> which states that anyone going sub-WR has to provide a replay. People are
> forever being emailed about suspiciously fast times, and in some cases
> having their accounts deleted. I've done it myself (deleted an account, I
> mean, not had a sub-WR time!)
>
> --
> David. (GPLRank handicap: -5.86)
> The GPL Scrapyard - http://www.hillclimbfan.f2s.com
> "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll,
really" -
> Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh.
In article <5_dG5.1916$[email hidden]>,
gjs <[email hidden]> wrote:
My ambition in gplrank is climbing up the ranks of my buddy list,
so I hardly ever spot clock smashed times or cheaters. All that
hard (and sometimes outright dirty ;-) work is done by my troop
of tireless fellow administrators scanning the track records for
fishy times.
I'd like to take the opportunity to thank them in public here.
GPLrank would *not* be the success that it is / has been
if it wasn't for their efforts.
Also, I'm truely indebted to Don Scurlock who's been playing the part
of "Mouth of Sauron" eer GPLRank ;-) here in RAS and has managed our
PR stuff amazingly effective. Had I been trying to answer all those
posts myself I hardly would have got any programming done ;-)
Cheers,
Uwe
--
Uwe Schuerkamp http://www.schuerkamp.de/
GnuPG Fingerprint: 2093 20B8 B861 9358 A356 B01A E145 9249 5D27 33EA
PGP Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61
