At last...

Great to be one of the first to post a message in this group. Personally I'm still a F1GP fan, but have heared rumours that I think will convince me that ICR might be better. After seeing ICR some 30 minutes and testing it some, I come to the conclusion that f1GP's graphic is much more clean. I don't think it's necessary with all the texturing in ICR. OK, the car graphics is neat, but does it matter for the feeling of the car? No.. What should be the highest priority in car simulators? The handling of the car! Is there anybody out there who thinks they have an "unbeatable" track record on F1GP(any tracks), feel free to mail me them.... The most incredible lap time I've seen (qualify/without cheeting) is on the Monaco track : 1:13:4... any better? Tim. SOFTWARE-94 0DH -- Tim Alexander Bye --- Oestfold Distrikts Hoeyskole Admin leder ----- Tvetervn. 2b ------------ Os Alle 11 3.IT ------

It's really great to get a group devoted just for the simulations. I received my final copy of Indycar Racing from Papyrus few weeks ago along with a letter and a T-shirt. The letter said that I can disclose that I was one of their Alpha/Beta tester if I didn't talk about their testing procedures. (oh it feels so good to let this one out) I believe that IRC is far better simulation than F1GP is. It's very easy to drive and feel good in F1GP because the game does most of the steering work for you(even at ace level). It was good at the begining. I never played a driving game that did not require several days of practice before I can feel good about driving the car in the game. But after I got good at the game, I started to notice things that I don't like. Steering was at the top of my list. I've read that some people drive without steering help, but I don't know how they can do it(assuming that they are using joystick). F1GP without steering help is like driving the car on ice! F1GP with steering help is not that great either. Although helpful at the begining, it prevents you from taking unconventional lines through corners to pass other cars. I have rear- ended computer cars in several occasions because this "help" didn't allow me to go around the car ahead of me. Steering control on the ICR, although not perfect, is completely up to me. I like the way the car feels on ovals very much, but I feel that the car lacks traction on street courses(for given down force). I also feels that lifting the throttle does not have as much effect on the cornering characteristics of the car as I expected. I drove formula ford at Skip Barbar racing school and know that formula ford will send you to a quick spin if you "lift" while a lot of side force is on the car. It may be because ICs get much of its downforce from wings and weight transfer doesn't matter as much. Or is it because of incorrect modeling? These are my critics of ICR. I don't dare to throw these critics at F1GP because they have much more problems to solve before dealing with fine issues like these. ---- Don't misunderstand me. I still LOVE my F1GP! One thing that ICR could not match was the sound. Engine noise on F1GP is so much better than that of ICR. Another thing that ICR cannot match is that it is a Formula One simulation. I like both F1 and IC, but like F1 better. I've been trying to convince Papyrus to come up with F1 circuits/cars add-on disk. Hope other people on the net can join me in convincing Papyrus. We now have two great car simulation games. Don't you feel lucky? y.e.

Hmmm... want to give any details of how you did this "lap"? (ie downforce, gear ratios, the lot!) Was there any slip-streaming? You'll understand I (and many other people) need to be convinced ;) Cheers, ;) David

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>I believe that IRC is far better simulation than F1GP is. It's very easy to >drive and feel good in F1GP because the game does most of the steering work >for you(even at ace level). It was good at the begining. I never played a >driving game that did not require several days of practice before I can feel >good about driving the car in the game. But after I got good at the game, >I started to notice things that I don't like. Steering was at the top of >my list. I've read that some people drive without steering help, but I don't >know how they can do it(assuming that they are using joystick). F1GP without >steering help is like driving the car on ice! F1GP with steering help is not >that great either. Although helpful at the begining, it prevents you from >taking unconventional lines through corners to pass other cars. I have rear- >ended computer cars in several occasions because this "help" didn't allow me >to go around the car ahead of me. >Steering control on the ICR, although not perfect, is completely up to me. >I like the way the car feels on ovals very much, but I feel that the car >lacks traction on street courses(for given down force). I also feels that >lifting the throttle does not have as much effect on the cornering >characteristics of the car as I expected. I drove formula ford at Skip >Barbar racing school and know that formula ford will send you to a quick >spin if you "lift" while a lot of side force is on the car. It may be >because ICs get much of its downforce from wings and weight transfer >doesn't matter as much. Or is it because of incorrect modeling?

I got ICR for my PC recently, having previously been ***ed to Indy 500 on the Amiga. Much to my suprise, ICR doesn't support the mouse for steering! Trying to steer with a joystick sucks rocks by comparison. Don't even mention keyboard. Why? They support mouse for selecting on menus, why not support it for steering? I can sort-of manage steering on ovals, though it's still marginal, but road courses are almost impossible. IRC also doesn't seem to work reasonably on a 4MB machine. I can't load most of the tracks, and the error message is less than helpful. I've removed everything of interest but the mouse driver and emm386. The docs basically say that if you have memory problems, use a boot disk. It's insane to have to boot from a floppy just to run a game (or totally modify your startup environment)! Oh well, I knew there was a reason I hated PC clones... ;-) -- GNU Emacs is a LISP operating system disguised as a word processor. - Doug Mohney, in comp.arch Randell Jesup, Jack-of-quite-a-few-trades, Commodore Engineering. Disclaimer: Nothing I say is anything other than my personal opinion.

This sounds like an almost perfect lap to me. I have sort of "specialized" in Monaco myself, and with a bit of experimenting with downforce I just scored my best lap of 1.13.944. There was no slip-streaming (a pity), nor was it at all perfect in other respects either - and with a little bit of help from other cars and a little bit cleaner driving I would think I can make it a good half a second quicker. However, I do use steering aid and traction control (although I think the latter is not of much use anyway) - I simply cannot imagine how people can drive without steering aid with a joystick. At Monaco the trick seems to be how to "throw" the car to corners. I used 60 for front and 40 for rear wings, and a tad rear-weighted brakes (5 units). All this to make the rear wheels a bit more loose and to make it possible to be a little daring with slides at the corners. I tried with 30 units of rear wing, but the car got a bit too wild for me, especially in the fast curves after the tunnel straight. Giving up tracking control has the same effect, although more pronounced. Somebody recommended full wing for both ends. This makes the car hopelessly slow to score good times. I tried - and made laps of 1.17 - 1.18. At Monaco I use, of course, rather short gear values. I can't remember the exact figures, but the values go from approximately 29 to 55. The steps I use (from 1-2 to 5-6) are usually: 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 and 9, making the car very quick to accelerate. This seems to be beneficial at every track, but especially so at Monaco. Yet I am sure there is still plenty room for improvement. With these values the top speed after the first "uphill" straight is around 280, after the tunnel approximately 290, and I can drive the fast curves between the tunnel and the pit lane entry well above 200 km/h (Sorry, I can't remember the actual names of the corners). Use your calculator if you want this in Mph. It is ridiculously easy to win a race at Monaco - I usually drive about 6-7 seconds per lap faster than the computer-controlled cars, even if I have made them a bit more powerful than my own car. It seems not to help, since they brake way too early at the corners. Making their "skill factor" better does not seem to have the desireable effect either. I just tried an 8-lap race and got 10.20.610 (1.17.58 average) with a less than perfect effort. So, how about others? Are you REALLY serious you can drive without steering aid, and this is a requirement for the Internet GP competition? Without tracking control it is relatively easy, but... Luru, a.k.a. Mika Hakkinen/McLaren-Ford

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>Subject: Re: At last... >Date: 8 Dec 93 22:24:25 GMT >Keywords: F1GP/ICR >>Is there anybody out there who thinks they have an "unbeatable" track record >>on F1GP(any tracks), feel free to mail me them.... >>The most incredible lap time I've seen (qualify/without cheeting) is on the >>Monaco track : 1:13:4... any better? >Hmmm... want to give any details of how you did this "lap"? (ie downforce, >gear ratios, the lot!) Was there any slip-streaming? >You'll understand I (and many other people) need to be convinced ;)

I've already read the other comment on this and that says it all doesn't it? By the way I think my comrade drives with a much more extreme wing setting. He keeps it very secret so I don't know the actual setting :-) Tim. SOFTWARE-94 0DH -- Tim Alexander Bye --- Oestfold Distrikts Hoeyskole Admin leder ----- Tvetervn. 2b ------------ Os Alle 11 3.IT ------

Does anybody have the full list of the key commands, documented & undocumented. And does anybody know how to print out the circuit layouts.

[Monaco tips deleted...] Ah.. You're the old Hakkinen.. The '94 version of Hakkinen drives a McLaren-Peugeot :-)

> >Is there anybody out there who thinks they have an "unbeatable" track record > >on F1GP(any tracks), feel free to mail me them.... There is a F1GP hall of fame, posted to comp.sys.amiga.games from time to time! Greetings, Tjark -- This is a typical case, whom we shall refer to as Mr. A, although his real name is this: +----------------------------------------------------------------+ Address: Thorenknick 6 33100 Paderborn Country: Germany Tel.: 0 52 52 / 39 12 (phone answering system) Computer: AMIGA 500 KS1.2 1MB w. 2 drives Occupation: Student +----------------------------------------------------------------+