No New Papyrus Products Please! (Ed or Rick)

Ed or Rick, Please DO NOT even consider ideas of products such as NHRA other forms of racing. It's bad enough that there is so much demand on Papyrus that you guys can barely keep up with the NASCAR and Indy simulations without additional products complicating the situation. The fact that some of the most critical improvements to NASCAR Racing cannot be made due to lack of time is a sign that Papyrus should stick to its two racing products. Sure, we'd all love to have great simulations of practically any form of racing, but let's stick to the two largest and most successful series in North America. Kirn Cromur

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> Ed or Rick, > Please DO NOT even consider ideas of products such as NHRA other forms of > racing. It's bad enough that there is so much demand on Papyrus that you > guys can barely keep up with the NASCAR and Indy simulations without > additional products complicating the situation. The fact that some of the > most critical improvements to NASCAR Racing cannot be made due to lack of > time is a sign that Papyrus should stick to its two racing products. Sure, > we'd all love to have great simulations of practically any form of racing, > but let's stick to the two largest and most successful series in North > America.

Kirn, from a participant point of view there may be no other motorracing sport with as many people actually doing it! The crowds aren't bad either! I may be biased in my veiw though! :-) Pete

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>Ed or Rick, >Please DO NOT even consider ideas of products such as NHRA other forms of >racing. It's bad enough that there is so much demand on Papyrus that you >guys can barely keep up with the NASCAR and Indy simulations without >additional products complicating the situation. The fact that some of the >most critical improvements to NASCAR Racing cannot be made due to lack of >time is a sign that Papyrus should stick to its two racing products. Sure, >we'd all love to have great simulations of practically any form of racing, >but let's stick to the two largest and most successful series in North >America. >Kirn Cromur

I take it that you don't own any Siera stock??? :-) Ed Martin Producer, Series Director NASCAR Racing League Papyrus / Sierra On-Line, Inc.

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> > Ed or Rick, > > Please DO NOT even consider ideas of products such as NHRA other forms of > > racing. It's bad enough that there is so much demand on Papyrus that you > > guys can barely keep up with the NASCAR and Indy simulations without > > additional products complicating the situation. The fact that some of the > > most critical improvements to NASCAR Racing cannot be made due to lack of > > time is a sign that Papyrus should stick to its two racing products. Sure, > > we'd all love to have great simulations of practically any form of racing, > > but let's stick to the two largest and most successful series in North > > America. > Kirn, from a participant point of view there may be no other motorracing sport > with as many people actually doing it! The crowds aren't bad either! I may be biased > in my veiw though! :-) > Pete

I can't quite agree with Kirn on the "no new products" concept, I think other race sims would be great...I can name several that would be very interesting. Motorcycles such as GP or dirt, especially GP, but not Road Rash clones (oops, too late). Car racing like Can-Am, SCCA, BTCC, Super Modifieds, Go-Carts, Classic Formula 1 (from the fifties), dirt track (Outlaws), Baja-buggy things...any of these would be great. Even Monster Trucks would be tons o'fun. Or Boats! But really, NHRA? How much fun would that be? All the fun in drag racing is in the garage so you can set up for a 7-10 second race that barely requires the use of a steering wheel? I think NOT! NHRA is a great spectator sport....the noise, the flash, the noise, the smell of burning ***, the smoke, and the noise (!) all make for a lot of fun at the local airport, but how could this be a fun sim with replay value? I don't see it. Neil -- Meek and obedient you follow the leader down well trodden corridors into the valley of steel.. Neil Yeatman, Ajax, Ontario, CANADA

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> But really, NHRA? How much fun would that be? All the fun in drag racing is > in the garage so you can set up for a 7-10 second race that barely requires > the use of a steering wheel? I think NOT! > NHRA is a great spectator sport....the noise, the flash, the noise, the smell of > burning ***, the smoke, and the noise (!) all make for a lot of fun at the > local airport, but how could this be a fun sim with replay value? I don't see it.

Neil, realizing we all have our personal prefs but one of the biggest challenges of racing any vehicle is setting up the chassis and dialing it in to the track. Whether it be Nascar, IndyCar, Formula 1 or motorcyles! The thing that would be the most fun about an NHRA sim would be learning to dial an engine in to the weather. We have all got a taste of what is required in real life to setup a Nascar or Indy chassis and with the pending release of F1GP 2, it as well but to my knowledge we haven't seen anything for us horse power freaks to test and tune with! These complexities haven't been addressed in any serious sim to date that I have ever seen. What better way to learn than with something that is 80% engine and clutch and 20% chassis. I have learned a tremendous amount about what is required to race a Nascar or Indy Car, to the point I have been able to carry on semi-intelligent conversations with real life Indy Car drivers, SCCA Trans-AM racers and other forms of racing as well! Not the fact to mention the reflexs and timing involved as well. Do you know what is required to tune a nitro funny car? Do you know what is required to figure out the clutch settings to get 6000 HP to the ground? Have you seen the weather stations these guys carry around with them. True, maybe this wouldn't appeal to you but I can think of hundreds of people I know in Drag racing that it sure would! Plus, almost everyone of them is carrying a PC of some discription around with them. Hopefully, I haven't bored you with my biased view and maybe this technical side wouldn't be of interest to others as it is me but I think it would be great! Besides, Papyrus, has assured me if they do the game they will package the smell of nitro and have the game release tire smoke when doing the burn out in the bleach box! :-) Pete > Neil Yeatman, Ajax, Ontario, CANADA

> Kirn, from a participant point of view there may be no other motorracing >sport >with as many people actually doing it! The crowds aren't bad either! I may be >biased >in my veiw though! :-) > Pete Besides what other motorsport can you practice on the way to work at the stoplights?;-) Gene

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>> >> Ed or Rick, >> >> Please DO NOT even consider ideas of products such as NHRA other forms of >> racing. It's bad enough that there is so much demand on Papyrus that you >> guys can barely keep up with the NASCAR and Indy simulations without >> additional products complicating the situation. The fact that some of the >> most critical improvements to NASCAR Racing cannot be made due to lack of >> time is a sign that Papyrus should stick to its two racing products. Sure, >> we'd all love to have great simulations of practically any form of racing, >> but let's stick to the two largest and most successful series in North >> America. >> > Kirn, from a participant point of view there may be no other > motorracing sport >with as many people actually doing it! The crowds aren't bad either! I may be > biased >in my veiw though! :-)

Drag racing takes no talent. Anymore, it's automatic transmissions and computer controlled induction. All you do is stab the gas and hold on. Ooooh ahhhh. I have to agree with the first guy (Kim) - an NHRA simuulator would be a burden on Papyrus' already stressed programming resources. I'd buy ICR2 before I bought anything to do with NHRA.... How about an air racing simulator. I'd like to throw a modified P-51 around the pylons a few times... /===================================================\

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| John Simmons (Redneck Techno-Biker) | | http://www2.connectnet.com/users/jms/index.html | |===================================================| | IGN #12 Zerex American Eagle Motorsports Ford | | http://www2.connectnet.com/users/jms/aemmain.html | | Hawaii NickName - AEMwest | |===================================================| | 93 FLSTC - 54,000 miles and counting | | Harley Scum Biker (tm) #14 |

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>>Ed or Rick, >>Please DO NOT even consider ideas of products such as NHRA other forms of >>racing. It's bad enough that there is so much demand on Papyrus that you >>guys can barely keep up with the NASCAR and Indy simulations without >>additional products complicating the situation. The fact that some of the >>most critical improvements to NASCAR Racing cannot be made due to lack of >>time is a sign that Papyrus should stick to its two racing products. Sure, >>we'd all love to have great simulations of practically any form of racing,

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>>but let's stick to the two largest and most successful series in North >>America. >>Kirn Cromur >I take it that you don't own any Siera stock??? :-) >Ed Martin >Producer, Series Director >NASCAR Racing League >Papyrus / Sierra On-Line, Inc.

Ed, I would really like to see a sprint car sim. Nothing like turning right to go left! Terry

yeah right, you tell Joh Force it takes no talent to go 300MPH in just 5 seconds. Have you ever watched this sport. Have you ever seen the in car camera shots as a pro stock car is racing for a low 7 sec pass they shift manually and you better get the shift right cause 1 missed shift and its over. Racing airplanes sounds like as much fun as wathcing paint dry. unless you crash into the other plane or the ground its not like you have to worry about hitting a wall or making any pit decions. Gene

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> > But really, NHRA? How much fun would that be? All the fun in drag racing is > > in the garage so you can set up for a 7-10 second race that barely requires > > the use of a steering wheel? I think NOT! > Do you know what is required to tune a nitro funny car? Do you know what is required to > figure out the clutch settings to get 6000 HP to the ground? Have you seen the weather stations > these guys carry around with them. True, maybe this wouldn't appeal to you but I can think of > hundreds of people I know in Drag racing that it sure would! Plus, almost everyone of them is > carrying a PC of some discription around with them.

Nope, I don't know, and personally, I really don't care, from a "driving sim" standpoint. I'm one of those guys that gets little or no joy from setting up ICR2 cars...I would prefer to have a computerized crew chief to follow my direction and give me the settings I need. I just want to drive, and I don't want to do it in 7-second increments. Hopefully if Papyrus follows through on a drag racing game, they'll put out a demo version...that way I'll get all the fix I need, and won't have any need to buy it. Let's get the ICR2 version of Hawaii out first (and available locally in Canada!), then Papyrus is free to do whatever the hell they want, including the Nanaimo Bathtub races, Soapbox Derby, and 3 legged-races. Are we talking Scratch n'Sniff here, Pete? Neil -- Meek and obedient you follow the leader down well trodden corridors into the valley of steel.. Neil Yeatman, Ajax, Ontario, CANADA

>Drag racing takes no talent. Anymore, it's automatic transmissions and >computer controlled induction. All you do is stab the gas and hold on. Ooooh >ahhhh. I have to agree with the first guy (Kim) - an NHRA simuulator would be >a burden on Papyrus' already stressed programming resources. I'd buy ICR2 >before I bought anything to do with NHRA.... Although I don't have any(much) interest in NHRA, I think it DOES take talent. Otherwise, you wouldn't see cars smoking the tires, or detonating engines... throw a modified P-51 around >the pylons a few times... I can't even RELATE to this. Not a flame, I just don't know ANYTHING about air racing. What's it like? ________ Eldred Pickett I am NOT paranoid. And why are you always watching me?!?

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> >>Drag racing takes no talent. Anymore, it's automatic transmissions and >>computer controlled induction. All you do is stab the gas and hold on. Ooooh >>ahhhh. I have to agree with the first guy (Kim) - an NHRA simuulator would be >>a burden on Papyrus' already stressed programming resources. I'd buy ICR2 >>before I bought anything to do with NHRA.... > >Although I don't have any(much) interest in NHRA, I think it DOES take talent. > Otherwise, you wouldn't see cars smoking the tires, or detonating engines...

The entire race is run/executed in the pits. Tire compounds, gears, motor changes are done one time. If a car doesn't win, it's because of the mechanics - NOT the driver. The only reason they have a driver is because it's cheaper than setting up all the electronics to remotely control the car. >>How about an air racing simulator. I'd like to throw a modified P-51 around >>the pylons a few times... > >I can't even RELATE to this. Not a flame, I just don't know ANYTHING about >air racing. What's it like? > They set up two - 4 pylons on a closed course and several planes race around them. The plane of choice (it seems) is the P51. Kinda like Nascar at 250 feet above the ground... /===================================================\

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| John Simmons (Redneck Techno-Biker) | | http://www2.connectnet.com/users/jms/index.html | |===================================================| | IGN #12 Zerex American Eagle Motorsports Ford | | http://www2.connectnet.com/users/jms/aemmain.html | | Hawaii NickName - AEMwest | |===================================================| | 93 FLSTC - 54,000 miles and counting | | Harley Scum Biker (tm) #14 |

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>The entire race is run/executed in the pits. Tire compounds, gears, motor >changes are done one time. If a car doesn't win, it's because of the >mechanics - NOT the driver. The only reason they have a driver is because >it's cheaper than setting up all the electronics to remotely control the >car. That just does it, can't really stay quiet anymore. I'm not a drag racer, but I KNOW it takes talent to DRIVE a DRAGSTER. What you are saying is that you can hop into Joe Amato's seat and do a 300mph run. I've even give you a month of training, if you were even ALLOWed to try it. YOU WON'T (99.99% certain). Gregory Fung Vancouver, B.C., Canada

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>> Kirn, from a participant point of view there may be no other >motorracing >>sport >>with as many people actually doing it! The crowds aren't bad either! I >may be >>biased >>in my veiw though! :-) >> Pete >Besides what other motorsport can you practice on the way to work at the >stoplights?;-)

Tell me about it! I tried taking 'apex' (NASCAR style) turns on a local expressway and got pulled over by the cops! ;) They're not bugs! They're random features!

Personally I really want to see a World Rally Championship sim, NASCAR may be the hottest spectator sport in America, but WRC is the most popular spectator motorsport in the world. Besides, 4wd turbo street cars sliding around dirt courses - can rallying be anything but *fun*? :) --------------------------------------------------------------------- Neil Mouneimne | "The Apples are coming! The Apples are coming! | ---CS-Anime-Bab5-SegaAM-Mtn_Bikes-RPGs-Newton-Ducatis-Hk-Glock-Rally--

You have no idea how a drag race is run , do you? The driver is very important. Have you ever watch them struggle to keep the car straight and in their own lane. Ever heard of reaction time at the start or how about a redlight? You keep saying they have no talent... go to your local dragstrip and get to know a few drivers and then tell them they have no talent. Gene