N2: Watkins Glen

I love the new Watkins Glen track vs N1. I am much faster than before, but I can only handle 92-93% realism in N2, which is much higher than in N1. My question is why are my brakes less grippy than the AI car? They can out brake me in any turn. Is there anything I can do to help brake better? FYI, I run a Thrustmaster T2. I also calibrated at about 90% throw so I know I have full throw on brakes and on the gas (a little trick I learned here on this group...thanks) () http://www.pacifier.com/~dtuso () Dominic Tuso () http://www.nicad.com/ () For you NiCd needs () http://www.teleport.com/~cramark () R/C car racing club () http://www.teleport.com/~lzwz/rcsr.htlml () R/C car racing club

: I love the new Watkins Glen track vs N1. I am much faster than before, but : I can only handle 92-93% realism in N2, which is much higher than in N1. : : My question is why are my brakes less grippy than the AI car? They can out : brake me in any turn. : : Is there anything I can do to help brake better? : : FYI, I run a Thrustmaster T2. I also calibrated at about 90% throw so I : know I have full throw on brakes and on the gas (a little trick I learned : here on this group...thanks) : Calibrate your brakes full throw. It's okay to short the gas calibration. Papy likes to "lock" the brakes when they are full on. Re-calibrate your brakes and then only apply 90-96.5%. You will find you have better braking power and better steering control. Now some other thoughts on the Glen: 1) What gives with the 35 mph parade lap and yellow lap speed around the course? Sure the pit speed limit is 35, but I highly doubt the real boys crawl around the course at 35. Did a race with the yellow on. The AI caused a yellow, 12+ minutes for 3 laps under yellow. The green flag drops and before the first lap is done the AI cause another yellow. Another 12+ minutes of crawling around the course at 35 mph. Almost a 1/2 hour lost and no racing. Can we get these speeds set to something more realistic? 2) What gives with the erractic lines the AI drivers take? Especially after turns 9 & 10. After turn 9 sometimes the AI will stay to the left of the road. The next time I try to pass on the right they decide to close the door as soon as I am up beside them. If they can stay on the left without my trying to make a pass, why can't they stay there when I'm passing 'em? Similar actions after turn 10. 3) Don't the AI race ahead of them? When approaching the inter-loop if the traffic is all balled up, some AI driver is making a bonzai run into turn 5. Scares the shit out of me everytime everytime I see 'em barreling down in the mirror and then see them fly by. God, the crew is getting tired of cleaning out my car every pit stop... Anyone got any tips for setups on this course? I wear out the LR way too soon. I've tried shifting weight to the right. I don't dare shift any more weight to the front as this tends to lessen my braking power. More than likely I need to change my driving style. -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

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> : I love the new Watkins Glen track vs N1. I am much faster than before, but > : I can only handle 92-93% realism in N2, which is much higher than in N1. > : > : My question is why are my brakes less grippy than the AI car? They can out > : brake me in any turn. > : > : Is there anything I can do to help brake better? > : > : FYI, I run a Thrustmaster T2. I also calibrated at about 90% throw so I > : know I have full throw on brakes and on the gas (a little trick I learned > : here on this group...thanks) > : > Calibrate your brakes full throw. It's okay to short the gas > calibration. Papy likes to "lock" the brakes when they are full on. > Re-calibrate your brakes and then only apply 90-96.5%. You will find > you have better braking power and better steering control. > Now some other thoughts on the Glen: > 1) What gives with the 35 mph parade lap and yellow lap speed around > the course? Sure the pit speed limit is 35, but I highly doubt the real > boys crawl around the course at 35. Did a race with the yellow on. The > AI caused a yellow, 12+ minutes for 3 laps under yellow. The green flag > drops and before the first lap is done the AI cause another yellow. > Another 12+ minutes of crawling around the course at 35 mph. Almost a > 1/2 hour lost and no racing. Can we get these speeds set to something > more realistic? > 2) What gives with the erractic lines the AI drivers take? Especially > after turns 9 & 10. After turn 9 sometimes the AI will stay to the left > of the road. The next time I try to pass on the right they decide to > close the door as soon as I am up beside them. If they can stay on the > left without my trying to make a pass, why can't they stay there when > I'm passing 'em? Similar actions after turn 10. > 3) Don't the AI race ahead of them? When approaching the inter-loop if > the traffic is all balled up, some AI driver is making a bonzai run > into turn 5. Scares the shit out of me everytime everytime I see 'em > barreling down in the mirror and then see them fly by. God, the crew is > getting tired of cleaning out my car every pit stop... > Anyone got any tips for setups on this course? I wear out the LR way too > soon. I've tried shifting weight to the right. I don't dare shift any > more weight to the front as this tends to lessen my braking power. More > than likely I need to change my driving style. > -- > **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* > Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Michael, The pace speeds in NASCAR 2 are in fact, accurate as of the 1996 season. This goes for all of the tracks. That's why you'll pace at 75mph at Talladega, and 35-45 at short tracks and road courses. As far as the AI goes, now you know how the actual drivers feel- some guys take consistent paths around the course, others seem to make it up as they go along. Just when you think you know somebody's driving habits pretty well, they show you what a real bonehead they are by blindly cutting you off. I'm pretty tough at the Glen on 100% opponent strength. Basically, the ACE setup is o.k., though I like to throw more right side weight into the car, since the important corners are right-handers. In general, hit the brakes as soon as you pull even with the farthest marker- when the car seems to settle down, ride or add as much gas as possible out of the corner, but be smooth. The long right hander that follows the inner loop is probably the one that requires the most patience.

: Michael, : The pace speeds in NASCAR 2 are in fact, accurate as of the 1996 season. : This goes for all of the tracks. That's why you'll pace at 75mph at : Talladega, and 35-45 at short tracks and road courses. Damn, I guess as long as I am not racing on NRO I'll just change the "pace" lap speed to 60 for the Glen. Just don't tell the NASCAR rule guys. ;-) : As far as the AI goes, now you know how the actual drivers feel- some : guys take consistent paths around the course, others seem to make it up : as they go along. Just when you think you know somebody's driving : habits pretty well, they show you what a real bonehead they are by : blindly cutting you off. Yeh, I know. But there are still a few really bad AI moves. But overall, the AI in NASCAR2 is better than any I've seen in any of Papyrus's past efforts. In some ways they are better than GP2's AI. However, they seem to lack the agressiveness GP2's AI have at trying to pass the human driver. : I'm pretty tough at the Glen on 100% opponent strength. Basically, the : ACE setup is o.k., though I like to throw more right side weight into : the car, since the important corners are right-handers. In general, hit : the brakes as soon as you pull even with the farthest marker- when the : car seems to settle down, ride or add as much gas as possible out of the : corner, but be smooth. The long right hander that follows the inner : loop is probably the one that requires the most patience. I'm getting there. Practice/Practice/Practice and few car setup tweaks have helped. I finally broke the 1:14 road block. Just once or twice so far (1:13:642 is my best in racing trim during practice). I've taken the default AI setup and put 0.3 more degrees of negative camber in the LF and 0.2 more in the RF. Set the shocks to LF 80 / RF 81 / LR 50 / RR 56. Set 4th gear to 4.00 and the left-side bias to 49.2. Now I can race in the top 10. I generally handle the approach & turn 9 pretty well. I am not sure that my approach is what one would consider "standard", but it works well for me. My biggest challenge to date is braking just right for turn 1. I just can't seem to get consistant on this one. It doesn't take much to brake too late or too early. I am still trying to find the Goldilocks approach to this one. -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

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> : Michael, > : The pace speeds in NASCAR 2 are in fact, accurate as of the 1996 season. > : This goes for all of the tracks. That's why you'll pace at 75mph at > : Talladega, and 35-45 at short tracks and road courses. > Damn, I guess as long as I am not racing on NRO I'll just change the > "pace" lap speed to 60 for the Glen. Just don't tell the NASCAR rule > guys. ;-) > : As far as the AI goes, now you know how the actual drivers feel- some > : guys take consistent paths around the course, others seem to make it up > : as they go along. Just when you think you know somebody's driving > : habits pretty well, they show you what a real bonehead they are by > : blindly cutting you off. > Yeh, I know. But there are still a few really bad AI moves. But > overall, the AI in NASCAR2 is better than any I've seen in any of > Papyrus's past efforts. In some ways they are better than GP2's AI. > However, they seem to lack the agressiveness GP2's AI have at trying > to pass the human driver. > : I'm pretty tough at the Glen on 100% opponent strength. Basically, the > : ACE setup is o.k., though I like to throw more right side weight into > : the car, since the important corners are right-handers. In general, hit > : the brakes as soon as you pull even with the farthest marker- when the > : car seems to settle down, ride or add as much gas as possible out of the > : corner, but be smooth. The long right hander that follows the inner > : loop is probably the one that requires the most patience. > I'm getting there. Practice/Practice/Practice and few car setup tweaks > have helped. I finally broke the 1:14 road block. Just once or twice > so far (1:13:642 is my best in racing trim during practice). I've taken > the default AI setup and put 0.3 more degrees of negative camber in the > LF and 0.2 more in the RF. Set the shocks to LF 80 / RF 81 / LR 50 / RR > 56. Set 4th gear to 4.00 and the left-side bias to 49.2. Now I can > race in the top 10. > I generally handle the approach & turn 9 pretty well. I am not sure that > my approach is what one would consider "standard", but it works well for > me. My biggest challenge to date is braking just right for turn 1. I > just can't seem to get consistant on this one. It doesn't take much to > brake too late or too early. I am still trying to find the Goldilocks > approach to this one. > -- > **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* > Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

A sub 1:14 ain't too shabby! Notice that the brake markers into one appear rather suddenly as you crest the straight. I start braking hard as soon as I pull even with the first one. I downshift all the way to first in evenly spaced, rapid movements. In second gear around one, my rpms drop too low, but in first gear, I maintain good power throughout the turn and can get back on the gas sooner.

You are carrying a lot of spped into Turn 1. I wait to brake until after the pavement change, rotate the car with the weight transfer to the front, get it tight inside, and let the car drift out over the FIA curbing which is angled and gives additional camber......oops, that's in my real racecar...not a clue how to do it in the sim...

: I generally handle the approach & turn 9 pretty well. I am not sure that : my approach is what one would consider "standard", but it works well for : me. My biggest challenge to date is braking just right for turn 1. I : just can't seem to get consistant on this one. It doesn't take much to : brake too late or too early. I am still trying to find the Goldilocks : approach to this one. Although I have yet to see the Glen for NCAR2, Mike, in NCAR1 I brake at the pitwall/armco seam on the inside of the track. Don't know how much this'll help, don't know the extent of changes made to the track - except heard about the new cerbs!! __o _-\<,_ Cosmo Potapoff

<<I generally handle the approach & turn 9 pretty well. I am not sure that my approach is what one would consider "standard", but it works well for me. My biggest challenge to date is braking just right for turn 1. I just can't seem to get consistant on this one. It doesn't take much to brake too late or too early. I am still trying to find the goldilocks approach to this one.>> That's understandable. Even in reality that is one of the most difficult turns on the track. Not only do you have to hit it properly, but it is a prime spot for someone to overtake you or for you to dish a little. It's very easy to brake too soon, but it's almost worst to brake too late. Personally, I brake about a hair past the first braking marker on the left. Stay wide to the left (unless someone is trying to pass on the inside) and you should be able to take turn one about 75-76mph using the unmodified ACE setting. I really don't change it too much since it gives me competetive race speed. You can do laps about 116-117 with no tweaking. Nick ______________________________________________________________ #6 & #94 in the quest for the Cup! My home away from home... http://www.mindspring.com/~ntotoro/ ______________________________________________________________

On Thu, 26 Dec 1996 01:07:07 -0500, "Aw C'mon!" >A sub 1:14 ain't too shabby! Notice that the brake markers into one >appear rather suddenly as you crest the straight. I start braking hard >as soon as I pull even with the first one. I downshift all the way to >first in evenly spaced, rapid movements. In second gear around one, my >rpms drop too low, but in first gear, I maintain good power throughout >the turn and can get back on the gas sooner. I've read that people are turning 120's in NASCAR2 at The Glen... Not Nascar1.. Nascar2 with full tanks of gas... I AM NOT ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE hitting 120's:) phew!

You can change this by changing the TTYPE line in the watglen.txt file. Change: TTYPE 0 to: TTYPE 3 this will increase the pacing speed to 75MPH. - jeff

: (Michael E. Carver) writes: : >1) What gives with the 35 mph parade lap and yellow lap speed around : >the course? Sure the pit speed limit is 35, but I highly doubt the real : >boys crawl around the course at 35. Did a race with the yellow on. The : >AI caused a yellow, 12+ minutes for 3 laps under yellow. The green flag : >drops and before the first lap is done the AI cause another yellow. : >Another 12+ minutes of crawling around the course at 35 mph. Almost a : >1/2 hour lost and no racing. Can we get these speeds set to something : >more realistic? : > : > : You can change this by changing the TTYPE line in the watglen.txt file. : Change: : TTYPE 0 : to: : TTYPE 3 : this will increase the pacing speed to 75MPH. I changed this in the last figure in the PACEA line. I went for 60. This works pretty good. However, the cars do seem to let off just a hair to allow the pace car to leave the track. -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

<snip> Hell. i can't even drive 75 at the Glen while under green..:-] Jim G.

You can change this by changing the TTYPE line in the watglen.txt file. Change: TTYPE 0 to: TTYPE 3 this will increase the pacing speed to 75MPH. - jeff

: (Michael E. Carver) writes: : >1) What gives with the 35 mph parade lap and yellow lap speed around : >the course? Sure the pit speed limit is 35, but I highly doubt the real : >boys crawl around the course at 35. Did a race with the yellow on. The : >AI caused a yellow, 12+ minutes for 3 laps under yellow. The green flag : >drops and before the first lap is done the AI cause another yellow. : >Another 12+ minutes of crawling around the course at 35 mph. Almost a : >1/2 hour lost and no racing. Can we get these speeds set to something : >more realistic? : > : > : You can change this by changing the TTYPE line in the watglen.txt file. : Change: : TTYPE 0 : to: : TTYPE 3 : this will increase the pacing speed to 75MPH. I changed this in the last figure in the PACEA line. I went for 60. This works pretty good. However, the cars do seem to let off just a hair to allow the pace car to leave the track. -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

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>: I generally handle the approach & turn 9 pretty well. I am not sure that >: my approach is what one would consider "standard", but it works well for >: me. My biggest challenge to date is braking just right for turn 1. I >: just can't seem to get consistant on this one. It doesn't take much to >: brake too late or too early. I am still trying to find the Goldilocks >: approach to this one. >Although I have yet to see the Glen for NCAR2, Mike, in NCAR1 I brake at >the pitwall/armco seam on the inside of the track. Don't know how much >this'll help, don't know the extent of changes made to the track - except >heard about the new cerbs!!

The N2 track is quite different from the N1 version. You can take the last turn of the esses flat out, the inner loop has been smoothed out and there's a nice downhill into the carousel that was flat in N1. As Michael mentioned, the AI is a lot of fun to dice with, especially going into T1. I make most of my passes on the AI in the last turn and running side by side in the carousel. Dave (davids) Sparks Late Night League http://www.sequoia-dev.com/Hawaii/latenite.html