Nascar 2 - I'd like to buy it, but...

I have bought ICR, ICR2 and GP2. But I had the chance to try them out first. I know the means for doing that are not always hum... legal but I think you should always be able to try something before you buy it, and it should not cost you a buck. I've tried the N2demo, it runs almost fine on my P100, but what I'd realy like is to have a chance to try the rendition version before I buy it. But wait! Don't flame me, I'm not done! What I wanted to know is: 1- Are there any demo versions of N2 including the rendition support? 2- Can you buy it, try it and then send it back if you don't like it without having to pay half the price of the game in shipping, handling and postage fees? I do not have N1, I am not a fan of nascars. But when I tried Indycar2's rendition release, it simply amazed me! It's just as if they re-invented simracing! The AI cars are moving so smoothly on the track, you can really do wheel to wheel racing... So with that in mind I thought I should give Nascar Racing a fair chance, and that's why I decided to buy it. But I don't want to get ripped-off, I'm just a poor student and even if I have a little money to spend, I don't need to waste it. See my point? Any help is welcome, or if you want to flame me for using pirated software before I bought ICR, ICR2 and GP2 then go ahead, I'd like to know what most people think about this situation where you have to buy surprise boxes and you don't have a clue if you'll like it or not, and sometimes I've wondered if there was anything useful in the box... My 2 cents A. Renault

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> I have bought ICR, ICR2 and GP2. But I had the chance to try them out > first. I know the means for doing that are not always hum... legal > but I think you should always be able to try something before you buy > it, and it should not cost you a buck. > I've tried the N2demo, it runs almost fine on my P100, but what I'd > realy like is to have a chance to try the rendition version before I > buy it. But wait! Don't flame me, I'm not done! > What I wanted to know is: > 1- Are there any demo versions of N2 including the rendition support? > 2- Can you buy it, try it and then send it back if you don't like it > without having to pay half the price of the game in shipping, handling > and postage fees? > I do not have N1, I am not a fan of nascars. But when I tried > Indycar2's rendition release, it simply amazed me! It's just as if > they re-invented simracing! The AI cars are moving so smoothly on the > track, you can really do wheel to wheel racing... So with that in > mind I thought I should give Nascar Racing a fair chance, and that's > why I decided to buy it. But I don't want to get ripped-off, I'm just > a poor student and even if I have a little money to spend, I don't > need to waste it. See my point? > Any help is welcome, or if you want to flame me for using pirated > software before I bought ICR, ICR2 and GP2 then go ahead, I'd like to > know what most people think about this situation where you have to buy > surprise boxes and you don't have a clue if you'll like it or not, and > sometimes I've wondered if there was anything useful in the box... > My 2 cents > A. Renault

C'mon, there's no need to pirate when stores in every country (except maybe Moldova) will let you return software within a certain period of time. Here in the states, Electronics Boutique give you between 10 and 30 days to return for any reason programs that you don't like. Find a store like that in your area and buy it there- if you don't like it, take it back for a refund. For that matter, I think Sierra offers a money back guarantee on direct orders. -Aw C'mon

>I do not have N1, I am not a fan of nascars. If you don't like NASCAR, you probably won't like our simulation of NASCAR either... Sierra has a 30-day money back guarantee, and many stores will allow you try the software and return it directly to them. If the store will not permit that, Sierra will take it back, but it's through the mail, and I think you pay the shipping... ---Jim Sokoloff, Papyrus

Buy it at Electonics Boutique. They have a 10 day no questions asked return policy. Haven't tried the rendition version yet so I can't help you there. Mike Lewis

Antoine: JIM: REPLY: Well let me state that I'm no fan of Nascar on TV (To me it's silly watching men drive in circles). But when you actually get to drive around the circles it's great fun. Sorta like the old baseball cliche for me. It's boring to watch but damn fun to play. So my bottom line is, playing Nascar is much different than watching Nascar, I think most anybody should agree. Antoine: REPLY: Nascar 2 Rendition is good, but it's not the quality of ICR2 in terms of smoothness or graphics. But again both graphics and smoothness are both very good. It's worth a look for sure. Q.B.M.

Hi, I saw a rebroadcast of a race from Rockingham on TNN last weekend and it amazes me how close NASCAR2 comes to the real thing. Sure there are a few things different, but I could regonize track side objects. If you watch NASCAR, playing the game gives you even more appreciation and understanding of the sport. John

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> I have bought ICR, ICR2 and GP2. But I had the chance to try them out > first. I know the means for doing that are not always hum... legal > but I think you should always be able to try something before you buy > it, and it should not cost you a buck. > I've tried the N2demo, it runs almost fine on my P100, but what I'd > realy like is to have a chance to try the rendition version before I > buy it. But wait! Don't flame me, I'm not done! > What I wanted to know is: > 1- Are there any demo versions of N2 including the rendition support? > 2- Can you buy it, try it and then send it back if you don't like it > without having to pay half the price of the game in shipping, handling > and postage fees? > I do not have N1, I am not a fan of nascars. But when I tried > Indycar2's rendition release, it simply amazed me! It's just as if > they re-invented simracing! The AI cars are moving so smoothly on the > track, you can really do wheel to wheel racing... So with that in > mind I thought I should give Nascar Racing a fair chance, and that's > why I decided to buy it. But I don't want to get ripped-off, I'm just > a poor student and even if I have a little money to spend, I don't > need to waste it. See my point? > Any help is welcome, or if you want to flame me for using pirated > software before I bought ICR, ICR2 and GP2 then go ahead, I'd like to > know what most people think about this situation where you have to buy > surprise boxes and you don't have a clue if you'll like it or not, and > sometimes I've wondered if there was anything useful in the box... > My 2 cents > A. Renault

To #1) No, the demo does not support the rendition acceleration.

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> C'mon, there's no need to pirate when stores in every country (except > maybe Moldova) will let you return software within a certain period of > time. Here in the states, Electronics Boutique give you between 10 and > 30 days to return for any reason programs that you don't like. Find a > store like that in your area and buy it there- if you don't like it, > take it back for a refund. For that matter, I think Sierra offers a > money back guarantee on direct orders. > -Aw C'mon

Read the policy closer. Electronics Boutique reserves the right to refuse a refund based on like or dislike. If it does not run on your system, they will refund your money. It is clearly posted at the register. David Martin

On Wed, 08 Jan 1997 22:10:40 -0500, "Aw C'mon!"

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>C'mon, there's no need to pirate when stores in every country (except >maybe Moldova) will let you return software within a certain period of >time. Here in the states, Electronics Boutique give you between 10 and >30 days to return for any reason programs that you don't like. Find a >store like that in your area and buy it there- if you don't like it, >take it back for a refund. For that matter, I think Sierra offers a >money back guarantee on direct orders.

I agree with you if it's true that you can really try it risk-free then that's what I'll do in the future. I am not a thief, I pay for what I like. And if I can try it legally before I buy it then that's the way it shall be done. I find it strange though (?) that software vendors do not place any emphasis on these details. If I had known there were such policies on returns then the problem would never have existed in the first place. Thank you for your answer. A. Renault

Does Electronics Boutique sell software in Canada (Quebec)? If not, is anyone aware of some place here where I could buy N2 on this risk-free basis? A. Renault

>I agree with you if it's true that you can really try it risk-free >then that's what I'll do in the future. I am not a thief, I pay for >what I like. And if I can try it legally before I buy it then that's >the way it shall be done. Nothing in life is risk free. If your money is that dear to you, perhaps you should avoid such a risk. If you use copyrighted software that you haven't paid for you *ARE* a thief, no matter how much you try to rationalize it. I hope that when you conclude your student years, join the real world, and try to make a living, that you won't mind others "sampling" the fruits of your labor. I find it strange, that if "try before you buy" or a money-back guarantee is so important to you, that you haven't asked retailers or publishers about this before. No, piracy was your *first* choice. BTW, stores in the US (such as Egghead or CompUSA) often have computers available to try programs before you buy. One less excuse... Before you send me UCE, I know what you're thinking... Did he complain to five or six postmasters last month? Now, you must ask yourself one question: "Do I feel lucky?" Well, do you, punk?

Hi Jim, Looks like they made the policy even better. I saw a posting from Sierra at Best Buy and it is a 90 day money back with the same conditions you describe. Regards, ---Wayne. ---Jim Sokoloff, Papyrus

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> > C'mon, there's no need to pirate when stores in every country (except > > maybe Moldova) will let you return software within a certain period of > > time. Here in the states, Electronics Boutique give you between 10 and > > 30 days to return for any reason programs that you don't like. Find a > > store like that in your area and buy it there- if you don't like it, > > take it back for a refund. For that matter, I think Sierra offers a > > money back guarantee on direct orders. > > -Aw C'mon > Read the policy closer. Electronics Boutique reserves the right to > refuse a refund based on like or dislike. If it does not run on your > system, they will refund your money. > It is clearly posted at the register. > David Martin

Electronics Boutique here in town say they'll refund for any reason; I've taken stuff back before (Madden '97, most recent example) and told the cashier that it just flat stunk. I had no problem with getting a refund.

On Sat, 11 Jan 1997 23:24:12 -0500, "Aw C'mon!"

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>> > C'mon, there's no need to pirate when stores in every country (except >> > maybe Moldova) will let you return software within a certain period of >> > time. Here in the states, Electronics Boutique give you between 10 and >> > 30 days to return for any reason programs that you don't like. Find a >> > store like that in your area and buy it there- if you don't like it, >> > take it back for a refund. For that matter, I think Sierra offers a >> > money back guarantee on direct orders. >> > -Aw C'mon >> Read the policy closer. Electronics Boutique reserves the right to >> refuse a refund based on like or dislike. If it does not run on your >> system, they will refund your money. >> It is clearly posted at the register. >> David Martin >Electronics Boutique here in town say they'll refund for any reason; >I've taken stuff back before (Madden '97, most recent example) and told >the cashier that it just flat stunk. I had no problem with getting a >refund.

Well, I have had no where take software back. for no reason. Once had a game that totally hosed my system to the point where I had to re-format my C drive..... still no return. lets see, Wal-Mart, Best Buy, Comp USA etc.... in my area, once you leave the store, your S.O.L. ........ Kinda sucks. Nascar 2 is cool, just wish it had all the features that were hinted at...... Blaine Bett Infinite Realms On-Line Entertainment, Inc. www.irealms.com The opinions expressed do not reflect the opinions of Infinite realms, Only me.....

I know but you always have to minimise the risk factor. Money is not that dear, but before I decide to eat bologna for the rest of the session so I can afford some product, I'd like to take down the risks to their minimal extent. I don't use, I try. These are two different concepts in my mind. When I like what I try, I buy. If I don't like what I try, I delete. I know it's hard for people wothout self-discipline to fit in the "shareware" concept, but you must admitt it has some good sides. There are many software products that I wouldn't have bought if I had not tried them first, simply because I didn't know of the product or didn't think it could be useful. If everyone could use their heads, the "shareware" concept would give good publicity to a product while also letting the user try before he buys. I know this isn't realistic, but I don't know why we have to put up with all the disadvantages. The companies have to take their share, and maybe if they did there would be less piracy. I also know Nascar 2 is not Shareware. But I think they sould at least release an updated demo so people can see what it actually looks like. I don't know about the USA's but here in Canada every engineer has to go through a "training period", wich is kinda like a trial period for your employer. I wouldn't ask anyone to pay for my services if my work did not fulfill their needs. In our time people pay for the results, not for the efforts. It's not fair, but that's the way it works. Only one problem... I'm not living in the USA and I haven't seen anything like that here in Canada. And believe me, I asked. Most of the stores I go to have a no returns policy on software, unless the media on wich it is written is defective. I'm glad to hear there are places wich let you try a product and give you a full satisfaction warranty, no questions asked. I am not condoning software piracy. I think that it contributes to the high prices we pay for our software. But I don't think I do contribute, because I don't redistribute pirated software, and in finally I almost alway buy that product, because if I'm willing to take the risk of getting it the wrong way to try it, it's mostly because I have a real interest in that product. Hope this clears things up. A. Renault

Does this include returning non-defective products, on a like-dislike basis? If so send me that number, I'm ordering it right now! A. Renault

: > Sierra has a 30-day money back guarantee, and many stores will allow : > you try the software and return it directly to them. If the store will : > not permit that, Sierra will take it back, but it's through the mail, : > and I think you pay the shipping... : Does this include returning non-defective products, on a like-dislike : basis? If so send me that number, I'm ordering it right now! Actually I am pretty positive that Sierra will take back their products whether you buy it direct through them or a re-seller. Sierra's refund policy can be found at: http://www.sierra.com/support/customer/refund.html -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

I bought ICR2 with a reduce manual version for 30$, when the complet pack is about 60$. The software is just the same in both versions, the complet game. So, this makes me think that what really has a big cost is the manual edition, not the software. Then, are we really spending our money in a "book"? Then, the software is not so expensive. Then, we are being deceived. Then ... Some people says that piracy makes software expensive. But i think that the prices of the software makes the piracy. Well... maybe both are truth at the same time. Good racing -- Damian Marin Ramirez / / ////////////// / / /\/ /\/ BORN TO DIE /\/ /\/ / / ///////////// / /

> >I do not have N1, I am not a fan of nascars. > If you don't like NASCAR, you probably won't like our simulation of > NASCAR either... That is sort of true. I am not fond of nascars, but I think the game is great. I don't play it as much because it simply isn't the same as icr2 but it is still cool.

If you watch NASCAR, playing the game gives you even more appreciation and understanding of the sport. Yep. I race every track before the real thing, and I find I understand lines, passing, and even crashing much better. Fantastic! The added realism of the tracks in Nascar2 is a real plus here. bob