Has anyone heard if Sierra plans to support 3Dfx or D3D acceleration
in their upcoming SODA Off-Road Racing sim?
I've seen mentions of Rendition support in this title but nothing
definite has been mentioned, and a look through the Sierra web site
did not reveal anything either.
I certainly hope they will take a step forward and start supporting
other 3D cards besides their own slower 3D accelerator.
Looking forward to this title but hoping they'll do the right thing
and give us a D3D or 3dfx version.
Cheers.
--John
--
Note: my real e-mail address is below. Delete the asterisks.
------------------------------+--------------------------
Seattle, Washington USA. | http://www.cool.com/~jsilva
Hi John,
For a preliminary review, have a look at SRN:
http://members.aol.com/simnews
Marc
Quoted text (7 lines)
>Hi John, >For a preliminary review, have a look at SRN: >http://members.aol.com/simnews >MarcSubject: Re: SODA Off-Road Racing 3Dfx or D3D support?
Date: 19 Jun 1997 00:25:10 GMT
>Wow! nice preview of this upcoming sim on your site Marc, keep up the
>good work.
Thanks John!! =)
Yes, it is fun!! The track editor is also a very cool addition, as
well as multiplayer...Even though esentially classed as an arcade game,
it should appeal to a few die hard simmers.
SODA is Direct-X compatible, so you should have any problems running
the game.
I also tried it on a non-Renditon 133 w/ Diamond Stealth-v64 2Mb DRAM,
and the game performed very nicely. This was even before the included
Direct-X3 drivers were installed!! I'll be going over the game over
the next few weeks, and report my findings.
Not sure, but very possible...a little too early to tell, but 3dfx
hasn't yet been ruled out as a possibilty. I believe Papyrus is still
looking into all the available 3D platforms to see which best shows
off their products.
Yes, it's too soon to tell...we should know more over the next few
months.
Well I must say, that of all the games I've seen (in pre-release form),
SODA is one of the best performing, and looks very close to being
finished. I can't comment on AI (and a few other items), because these
areas are still under development. However, if their AI-etc. look as
good as what I see here, we're in for a hellava' game...and if this is
an indication of future Papyrus products, then we'll all be sitting
pretty. =)
Cheers!
Marc
Marc J. Nelson
Sim Racing News - USA
http://members.aol.com/simnews
> SODA is Direct-X compatible, so you should have any problems running
> the game.
That's an interesting Freudian (Gates-ian?) slip...
---Jim
>I am however, disappointed that it seems Sierra will only be supporting the
If you're really a fan of serious racing sims, then the Verite is your
only option right now, just as the Voodoo is the only option for
console-style games. Why not just get a Verite, instead of waiting for a
vaporware 3DFX N2 patch?
Why is this a conflict of interest? How is it unethical for a software
company to produce hardware? Electronic Arts is investing heavily in
3DFX, according to SEC filings. Is that a conflict of interest?
Lack of 3DFX support in Nascar 2 hardly seems to have been a "mistake";
it's one of the top-selling games and best-reviewed games of the year.
Quoted text (7 lines)
>Rendition3D family of cards in this product so once again we >Voodoo owners will still have to keep waiting for a real 3dfx supported >racing sim. >I'll have to wait until after it's release to hear how well it would >run on my P166 without a Rendition card, but I still keep wishing Sierra >would face reality and start supporting D3D or 3dfx in it's products, >maybe even retrofit D3D/3dfx versions of ICR2 and Nascar2 ;-)ooops! =P
Marc
Quoted text (15 lines)
>>I am however, disappointed that it seems Sierra will only be supporting >the >>Rendition3D family of cards in this product so once again we >>Voodoo owners will still have to keep waiting for a real 3dfx supported >>racing sim. >>I'll have to wait until after it's release to hear how well it would >>run on my P166 without a Rendition card, but I still keep wishing Sierra >>would face reality and start supporting D3D or 3dfx in it's products, >>maybe even retrofit D3D/3dfx versions of ICR2 and Nascar2 ;-) >If you're really a fan of serious racing sims, then the Verite is your >only option right now, just as the Voodoo is the only option for >console-style games. Why not just get a Verite, instead of waiting for a >vaporware 3DFX N2 patch?Um... Hello? Sierra does support the 3Dfx cards as well as Direct3D. It
just so happens that the current Papyrus sims do not (SODA's 3D future may
still be undeciced, but Grand Prix Legends should run on both Rendition and
3Dfx cards, most likely through Direct3D). As a matter of fact,
***gladiators has a Native Voodoo GLide version and the Rendtion cards
settle for the Direct3D version. The version of A-10 Tank Killer bundled
with the Sierra card also uses Direct3D. Sierra has also stated that both
cards will be supported in future releases.
--
[link lost in import]
>Why is the Verite architecture better for sims than 3Dfx (if this is
>what you're implying)? If anyone can give me explicit, precise
>technical reasons why Indycar or Nascar cannot run in Direct3D
>or 3Dfx native, I'm all ears... OTOH, I can think of a few marketing
>reasons why Sierra sticks with Redition only.
Sierra doesn't stick with Rendition only.
Have you played the Win95 version? Like the DOS version better? (I
do.)
Impossible? no. Easy? no. Worth it? Probably not back when the games
were being developed. Definitely not now.
All they do is bundle and sell a video card manufactured by someone
else. They probably end up making more money on an individual game
sale than a video card sale.
Sierra does support 3Dfx. Papyrus sims to date haven't. From your
question, I presume that you believe it's just a matter of typing
something like:
c:\NASCAR2\CODE\GRAPHICS\> SUPPORT 3DFX TOO
and bingo! N2 would support the 3Dfx card. (It's not.)
Perhaps you'd be willing to think about the conclusion that Papyrus
can't justify (with additional unit sales) the costs of porting their
ICR2/N2 graphics pipeline to 3Dfx. Not a technical problem mind you,
but a resource-allocation and business problem.
---Jim Sokoloff
In my original post, I was referring to Indycar II, Nascar II, and SODA only.
Sorry if the post was ambiguous about this point.
I figured Sierra had at least one Direct3D in their list of software, as it's
large.
I still stand by my original request to Sierra for at least making SODA 3Dfx
or Direct3D compatible, if they can't make Indycar II the same for scheduling
or financial reasons.
>Perhaps you'd be willing to think about the conclusion that Papyrus
>can't justify (with additional unit sales) the costs of porting their
>ICR2/N2 graphics pipeline to 3Dfx. Not a technical problem mind you,
>but a resource-allocation and business problem.
I suppose you're bound by Sierra to do the Verite', and not the 3DFX?
If not, I'd say do 3DFX only.
Although I do have both cards, the 3DFX flat out spanks the Verite'
card. It is very noticable on games from the Sierra bundle that run
on both cards -like ***Gladiators.
Another question (don't know if you'd know this or not)...
Did 3DFX themselves do some of the first 3DFX ports, like Descent?
I'm sure they'd like to see the Papyrus sims running on their card.
Right now (to me), your sims are the only reason for owning a Verite'
card. I'd love to be able to run NASCAR Racing 2 on 3DFX, and yank
the Screamin' 3D in favor of something like a Millenium.
--
Not the best example since ***gladiators has a Voodoo Native Glide
version and the Rendition runs the Direct3D version. With the current
version of Direct3D, the Rendition card's use of DMA doesn't buy any speed
increases. I still agree the Voodoo cards are superior, but not to the
degree that you suggest.
--
[link lost in import]
>If you're really a fan of serious racing sims, then the Verite is your
>only option right now, just as the Voodoo is the only option for
>console-style games. Why not just get a Verite, instead of waiting for a
>vaporware 3DFX N2 patch?
I already have a Matrox Millenium for my 2D video card needs and a Monster 3D
for my 3D needs, adding a Rendition card would mean having to sacrifice the
fast Win95 and DOS speed of my Matrox. Don't think I didn't consider it :-)
ICR2 Rendition version looks amazing and almost made me buy a Rendition Card.
Well, I never said it was unethical only that supporting their own product
does not have to extend to NOT supporting competing 3D card products.
I saw posts on the c.s.i.p.g.sports by Ken Williams head of Sierra saying
they would be supporting 3dfx or D3D in their future games and not just
Rendition 3D support, and so far this promise has not come true as far as
I can tell. As a 3dfx owner I am hoping he will deliver on his promise.
As a very satisfied owner of Nascar2, I'll have to agree with you that
N2 is a terrific sim, BUT I bought it when it was released at around X-Mas
time, before 3dfx had made their mark as the leading 3D chipset in the 3D
accelerator market, and before I had purchased a 3dfx card. I'm sure I'm
not the only one in this situation, as the popularity and sales of Voodoo
based cards and other 3D cards that support D3D have grown in the last few
months due to the drop in prices for these cards.
If Sierra releases titles this year or at X-mas time WITHOUT D3D or 3dfx
support, it's going to cost them many sales from typical race simmers like
me who have made the move to fast 3D cards like Voodoo and are not going to
be happy running the slower and plainer versions of titles like N2 when
they know that Sierra has included an enhanced Rendition 3D version but
decided not to port it to other popular 3D cards because they compete with
it's own 3D video card.
I have nothing against Sierra putting out enhanced Rendition versions,
by all means they should support their own product, but this should not
preclude them from supporting other widely supported 3D cards, at least
if they expect the owners of these cards to purchase their products.
Cheers.
--John (who is looking forward to SODA Offroad Racing and hoping Sierra will
wake up and see all the extra sales 3dfx support will give them.)
--
Note: my real e-mail address is below. Delete the asterisks.
------------------------------+--------------------------
Seattle, Washington USA. | http://www.cool.com/~jsilva
R:
You can also today order Motoracer which has dirt bikes and jumps which is
somewhat comparable to Soda racing along with street racers. This game is
classified as arcadish, supports 8 multiplayer and runs on both Voodoo and
Rendition at ridiculous speeds. I will go on to state which I feel is very
important. There has to be a catergory between SIM and ARCADE. As Motoracer
falls into it. It's arcadish in the terms that you aren't heavily penalized
for crashes, it's closer to simmish in terms or actual control and feel. The
later is most critical IMO. Now going to the Arcade I fiddled with Sega's Indy
500 for about 1 whole minute before I stood up and claimed publically it was a
piece of shi!. The car had absolutley no feel. They make these games so you
can't help but crash and can't go far for $.75. So IMO Motoracer goes well
beyond your typical Arcade game thus I don't feel it's fair being lable soley
as one. The control of the vehicle is paramont in my beliefs to making a good
racing game.
I love N2 and I love Motoracer. Both are excellent, both are available today,
to bad both don't support voodoo.
Q.B.M.
Quoted text (7 lines)
>>Perhaps you'd be willing to think about the conclusion that Papyrus >>can't justify (with additional unit sales) the costs of porting their >>ICR2/N2 graphics pipeline to 3Dfx. Not a technical problem mind you, >>but a resource-allocation and business problem. >I suppose you're bound by Sierra to do the Verite', and not the 3DFX? >If not, I'd say do 3DFX only.>I am however, disappointed that it seems Sierra will only be supporting the
>Rendition3D family of cards in this product so once again we
>Voodoo owners will still have to keep waiting for a real 3dfx supported
>racing sim.
Hey, there is nothing stopping you from adding a Verite card to your
Voodoo card. I'm seriously thinking of doing this myself (I have a
Verite card now and will be adding 3DFX soon). This way, you'll have
all the bases covered and no matter what your *** preference, just
run the version that suits you! Rather simple, isn't it?
Hmmm, maybe Ford has a conflict of interest becuae they sell parts for
their cars. Even recommend that you bring them to thier dealers for
servicing. What will those bastards do next eh?
If I was looking for a game/sim that was at the top of my list I
would:
a) Just buy the thing.
b) Just buy the thing and then get the other graphics card too.
If you've got a 3DFX card right now, then you're most likely not
running with a base system. Am I right? Well, then your ninja system
will run these games smoothly anyway or you can most likely afford the
Verite card also.
Cheers to you too John.
Karl
