CMR 4 demo review

Hi, here's my review of CMR 4 after a couple of hours at the wheel. Firstly, I'm from a rallying background, so I'm biased towards the "sim" i.e. physics, realism side of things. I was a regular Rally Trophy online racer for a couple of years. I also drove an escort and Golf at the club rally level for 10 years. As others have mentioned, the graphics are outstanding! For the first time ever on a computer, when I was driving on a gravel section and got some splotches of dust/mud on the windscreen (before Colin kindly flicked his wipers to get rid of them within the arc of the wiper blades), I actually shook my head for a moment and did a double take to check that I wasn't watching a video of a real scene. Other attention to detail includes the damage model, and small things like the tyre marks left on the road, and especially on the muddy sections. I think Richard Burns Rally will have a hard time beating this aspect of CMR 3. 9/10 for the graphics. Now, onto the important (for me) stuff. The physics are one hell of an improvement over the rotating on axis stuff that we were given in the previous CMR series. The car obviously has independent suspension, and each wheel is modeled independently in real time. However, the physics model has been "dampered" for lack of a better word, for all the gamers out there who would otherwise give up after 30 minutes of trying and take the game back for a refund. I understand the business model for CMR 4, and that hard core sim racers form a very small (and unprofitable) minority of the players. There is also the issue of having a common code base across platforms, where most console (xbox - Ps/2) users wouldn't have the controls necessary for a sharp and accurate driving model. Having said that, it would be nice if the full release for PC has some type of advanced driving mode. As such, I'll still be waiting for Richard Burns Rally to meet the sim racers' needs. Onto some specifics. The single demo car (4WD Citroen) does hanndle something like a 4WD rally car - that is heaps of understeer unless you put the boot in or scando it into corners (flick the wrong way then over correct into the corner). The throttle off oversteer is also there, but is just too predictable and easy. Basically, alsmost any curve greater than a "2" can be taken by not even touching the brakes but simply turning in early and at the same time backing off the throttle to push the weight forward and induce oversteer. Controlling the car then is a simply 10-20 degrees of opposite lock through the corner, or a 4 wheel drift through the tighter corners. IMHO this is just way too easy to do and is not challenging nor realistic. The tight corners and hairpins can either be taken easily with full understeer (the slow way), or by braking earlier, changing down to 1st or 2nd and putting on full throttle before the apex to do a nice slide around the corner. Again, this technique has been "dumded" down for the game. In real life, full throttle all the way around the corner would produce an instant spin - judicious application of the throttle is required to balance the car. One of the biggest dissapointments is the lack of throttle control. Most of the time, suddenly applying full throttle does nothing more than make the car go faster, even when cornering. There is no sense of wheelspin or the resultant slide, much less being able to feel which wheel(s) are spinning and resultant behaviour. At least CMR 4 is good enough to teach the non-sim racer (read: average game) the basics of oversteer and understeer - this is required for fast times. Hopefully, it may give them an incentive to move up to the (hopefully) more realistic Richard Burns Rally when it is released. Summary: In summary, the demo is worth a download (if you have broadband). The wet road of Japan is by far the most realistic and fun of the stages As mentioned at the start, I'm being harsh as I'm wearing my "Sim racer" hat. For the gamers that enjoyed CMR 3, this is by far the biggest improvement of the series and finally offers something approaching the physics of an actual car. Combined with the incredible graphics, it is sure to be a best seller and I'm sure will get rave reviews in the gaming press. As for me, I won't delete it immediately as I did with the CMR 3 demo, but will keep playing it a bit to keep me occupied until RBR comes out in a few months.

Thanks for that review. Do you have a url to download the demo from? eppy wrote:

Quoted text (80 lines)

> Hi, here's my review of CMR 4 after a couple of hours at the wheel. > > Firstly, I'm from a rallying background, so I'm biased towards the "sim" > i.e. physics, realism side of things. I was a regular Rally Trophy online > racer for a couple of years. I also drove an escort and Golf at the club > rally level for 10 years. > > As others have mentioned, the graphics are outstanding! For the first time > ever on a computer, when I was driving on a gravel section and got some > splotches of dust/mud on the windscreen (before Colin kindly flicked his > wipers to get rid of them within the arc of the wiper blades), I actually > shook my head for a moment and did a double take to check that I wasn't > watching a video of a real scene. Other attention to detail includes the > damage model, and small things like the tyre marks left on the road, and > especially on the muddy sections. I think Richard Burns Rally will have a > hard time beating this aspect of CMR 3. 9/10 for the graphics. > > Now, onto the important (for me) stuff. > > The physics are one hell of an improvement over the rotating on axis stuff > that we were given in the previous CMR series. The car obviously has > independent suspension, and each wheel is modeled independently in real > time. However, the physics model has been "dampered" for lack of a better > word, for all the gamers out there who would otherwise give up after 30 > minutes of trying and take the game back for a refund. > > I understand the business model for CMR 4, and that hard core sim racers > form a very small (and unprofitable) minority of the players. There is also > the issue of having a common code base across platforms, where most console > (xbox - Ps/2) users wouldn't have the controls necessary for a sharp and > accurate driving model. Having said that, it would be nice if the full > release for PC has some type of advanced driving mode. As such, I'll still > be waiting for Richard Burns Rally to meet the sim racers' needs. > > Onto some specifics. > > The single demo car (4WD Citroen) does hanndle something like a 4WD rally > car - that is heaps of understeer unless you put the boot in or scando it > into corners (flick the wrong way then over correct into the corner). The > throttle off oversteer is also there, but is just too predictable and easy. > Basically, alsmost any curve greater than a "2" can be taken by not even > touching the brakes but simply turning in early and at the same time backing > off the throttle to push the weight forward and induce oversteer. > Controlling the car then is a simply 10-20 degrees of opposite lock through > the corner, or a 4 wheel drift through the tighter corners. IMHO this is > just way too easy to do and is not challenging nor realistic. > > The tight corners and hairpins can either be taken easily with full > understeer (the slow way), or by braking earlier, changing down to 1st or > 2nd and putting on full throttle before the apex to do a nice slide around > the corner. Again, this technique has been "dumded" down for the game. In > real life, full throttle all the way around the corner would produce an > instant spin - judicious application of the throttle is required to balance > the car. > > One of the biggest dissapointments is the lack of throttle control. Most of > the time, suddenly applying full throttle does nothing more than make the > car go faster, even when cornering. There is no sense of wheelspin or the > resultant slide, much less being able to feel which wheel(s) are spinning > and resultant behaviour. > > At least CMR 4 is good enough to teach the non-sim racer (read: average > game) the basics of oversteer and understeer - this is required for fast > times. Hopefully, it may give them an incentive to move up to the > (hopefully) more realistic Richard Burns Rally when it is released. > > Summary: > > In summary, the demo is worth a download (if you have broadband). The wet > road of Japan is by far the most realistic and fun of the stages > > As mentioned at the start, I'm being harsh as I'm wearing my "Sim racer" > hat. For the gamers that enjoyed CMR 3, this is by far the biggest > improvement of the series and finally offers something approaching the > physics of an actual car. Combined with the incredible graphics, it is sure > to be a best seller and I'm sure will get rave reviews in the gaming press. > > As for me, I won't delete it immediately as I did with the CMR 3 demo, but > will keep playing it a bit to keep me occupied until RBR comes out in a few > months.

Thanks for that review. Do you have a url to download the demo from?

Quoted text (80 lines)

> Hi, here's my review of CMR 4 after a couple of hours at the wheel. > Firstly, I'm from a rallying background, so I'm biased towards the "sim" > i.e. physics, realism side of things. I was a regular Rally Trophy online > racer for a couple of years. I also drove an escort and Golf at the club > rally level for 10 years. > As others have mentioned, the graphics are outstanding! For the first time > ever on a computer, when I was driving on a gravel section and got some > splotches of dust/mud on the windscreen (before Colin kindly flicked his > wipers to get rid of them within the arc of the wiper blades), I actually > shook my head for a moment and did a double take to check that I wasn't > watching a video of a real scene. Other attention to detail includes the > damage model, and small things like the tyre marks left on the road, and > especially on the muddy sections. I think Richard Burns Rally will have a > hard time beating this aspect of CMR 3. 9/10 for the graphics. > Now, onto the important (for me) stuff. > The physics are one hell of an improvement over the rotating on axis stuff > that we were given in the previous CMR series. The car obviously has > independent suspension, and each wheel is modeled independently in real > time. However, the physics model has been "dampered" for lack of a better > word, for all the gamers out there who would otherwise give up after 30 > minutes of trying and take the game back for a refund. > I understand the business model for CMR 4, and that hard core sim racers > form a very small (and unprofitable) minority of the players. There is also > the issue of having a common code base across platforms, where most console > (xbox - Ps/2) users wouldn't have the controls necessary for a sharp and > accurate driving model. Having said that, it would be nice if the full > release for PC has some type of advanced driving mode. As such, I'll still > be waiting for Richard Burns Rally to meet the sim racers' needs. > Onto some specifics. > The single demo car (4WD Citroen) does hanndle something like a 4WD rally > car - that is heaps of understeer unless you put the boot in or scando it > into corners (flick the wrong way then over correct into the corner). The > throttle off oversteer is also there, but is just too predictable and easy. > Basically, alsmost any curve greater than a "2" can be taken by not even > touching the brakes but simply turning in early and at the same time backing > off the throttle to push the weight forward and induce oversteer. > Controlling the car then is a simply 10-20 degrees of opposite lock through > the corner, or a 4 wheel drift through the tighter corners. IMHO this is > just way too easy to do and is not challenging nor realistic. > The tight corners and hairpins can either be taken easily with full > understeer (the slow way), or by braking earlier, changing down to 1st or > 2nd and putting on full throttle before the apex to do a nice slide around > the corner. Again, this technique has been "dumded" down for the game. In > real life, full throttle all the way around the corner would produce an > instant spin - judicious application of the throttle is required to balance > the car. > One of the biggest dissapointments is the lack of throttle control. Most of > the time, suddenly applying full throttle does nothing more than make the > car go faster, even when cornering. There is no sense of wheelspin or the > resultant slide, much less being able to feel which wheel(s) are spinning > and resultant behaviour. > At least CMR 4 is good enough to teach the non-sim racer (read: average > game) the basics of oversteer and understeer - this is required for fast > times. Hopefully, it may give them an incentive to move up to the > (hopefully) more realistic Richard Burns Rally when it is released. > Summary: > In summary, the demo is worth a download (if you have broadband). The wet > road of Japan is by far the most realistic and fun of the stages > As mentioned at the start, I'm being harsh as I'm wearing my "Sim racer" > hat. For the gamers that enjoyed CMR 3, this is by far the biggest > improvement of the series and finally offers something approaching the > physics of an actual car. Combined with the incredible graphics, it is sure > to be a best seller and I'm sure will get rave reviews in the *** press. > As for me, I won't delete it immediately as I did with the CMR 3 demo, but > will keep playing it a bit to keep me occupied until RBR comes out in a few > months.

"BRH @comcast.net>" <"bhoenig<no-spam> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Thanks for that review. Do you have a url to download the demo from? http://www.bhmotorsports.com/CMR4/downloads This game is so much fun! I agree with eppy, on the graphics, they are stunning, and they run silky smooth on my old Radeon 8500 and Athlon 1700+. The Japan stage is awesome! The physics are very good IMHO. They may not be 100%, but realistic enough for my tastes. Now I'd like to see Richard Burns Rally.

Well I'd like to try it but when i choose TWO axis 2 BUTTON Joystick I'm forced to assign more that 2 buttons worth of controls which my wheel doesnt have. lol. I cant assign the other controls: handbrake, camera view and whatever else to the keyboard so I can select accept. Let me know if I'm missing something. "eppy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Q4R_b.145167$[email hidden]...

Quoted text (28 lines)

> Hi, here's my review of CMR 4 after a couple of hours at the wheel. > > Firstly, I'm from a rallying background, so I'm biased towards the "sim" > i.e. physics, realism side of things. I was a regular Rally Trophy online > racer for a couple of years. I also drove an escort and Golf at the club > rally level for 10 years. > > As others have mentioned, the graphics are outstanding! For the first time > ever on a computer, when I was driving on a gravel section and got some > splotches of dust/mud on the windscreen (before Colin kindly flicked his > wipers to get rid of them within the arc of the wiper blades), I actually > shook my head for a moment and did a double take to check that I wasn't > watching a video of a real scene. Other attention to detail includes the > damage model, and small things like the tyre marks left on the road, and > especially on the muddy sections. I think Richard Burns Rally will have a > hard time beating this aspect of CMR 3. 9/10 for the graphics. > > Now, onto the important (for me) stuff. > > The physics are one hell of an improvement over the rotating on axis stuff > that we were given in the previous CMR series. The car obviously has > independent suspension, and each wheel is modeled independently in real > time. However, the physics model has been "dampered" for lack of a better > word, for all the gamers out there who would otherwise give up after 30 > minutes of trying and take the game back for a refund. > > I understand the business model for CMR 4, and that hard core sim racers > form a very small (and unprofitable) minority of the players. There is

also > the issue of having a common code base across platforms, where mostconsole

Quoted text (11 lines)

> (xbox - Ps/2) users wouldn't have the controls necessary for a sharp and > accurate driving model. Having said that, it would be nice if the full > release for PC has some type of advanced driving mode. As such, I'll still > be waiting for Richard Burns Rally to meet the sim racers' needs. > > Onto some specifics. > > The single demo car (4WD Citroen) does hanndle something like a 4WD rally > car - that is heaps of understeer unless you put the boot in or scando it > into corners (flick the wrong way then over correct into the corner). The > throttle off oversteer is also there, but is just too predictable and

easy. > Basically, alsmost any curve greater than a "2" can be taken by not even > touching the brakes but simply turning in early and at the same timebacking > off the throttle to push the weight forward and induce oversteer. > Controlling the car then is a simply 10-20 degrees of opposite lockthrough

Quoted text (9 lines)

> the corner, or a 4 wheel drift through the tighter corners. IMHO this is > just way too easy to do and is not challenging nor realistic. > > The tight corners and hairpins can either be taken easily with full > understeer (the slow way), or by braking earlier, changing down to 1st or > 2nd and putting on full throttle before the apex to do a nice slide around > the corner. Again, this technique has been "dumded" down for the game. In > real life, full throttle all the way around the corner would produce an > instant spin - judicious application of the throttle is required to

balance > the car. > > One of the biggest dissapointments is the lack of throttle control. Mostof

Quoted text (20 lines)

> the time, suddenly applying full throttle does nothing more than make the > car go faster, even when cornering. There is no sense of wheelspin or the > resultant slide, much less being able to feel which wheel(s) are spinning > and resultant behaviour. > > At least CMR 4 is good enough to teach the non-sim racer (read: average > game) the basics of oversteer and understeer - this is required for fast > times. Hopefully, it may give them an incentive to move up to the > (hopefully) more realistic Richard Burns Rally when it is released. > > > Summary: > > In summary, the demo is worth a download (if you have broadband). The wet > road of Japan is by far the most realistic and fun of the stages > > As mentioned at the start, I'm being harsh as I'm wearing my "Sim racer" > hat. For the gamers that enjoyed CMR 3, this is by far the biggest > improvement of the series and finally offers something approaching the > physics of an actual car. Combined with the incredible graphics, it is

sure > to be a best seller and I'm sure will get rave reviews in the gamingpress. > > As for me, I won't delete it immediately as I did with the CMR 3 demo, but > will keep playing it a bit to keep me occupied until RBR comes out in afew > months. > > >

I wish I could play it! It won't run on my Radeon 7500.. Mike http://mikebeauchamp.com "eppy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Q4R_b.145167$[email hidden]...

Quoted text (28 lines)

> Hi, here's my review of CMR 4 after a couple of hours at the wheel. > > Firstly, I'm from a rallying background, so I'm biased towards the "sim" > i.e. physics, realism side of things. I was a regular Rally Trophy online > racer for a couple of years. I also drove an escort and Golf at the club > rally level for 10 years. > > As others have mentioned, the graphics are outstanding! For the first time > ever on a computer, when I was driving on a gravel section and got some > splotches of dust/mud on the windscreen (before Colin kindly flicked his > wipers to get rid of them within the arc of the wiper blades), I actually > shook my head for a moment and did a double take to check that I wasn't > watching a video of a real scene. Other attention to detail includes the > damage model, and small things like the tyre marks left on the road, and > especially on the muddy sections. I think Richard Burns Rally will have a > hard time beating this aspect of CMR 3. 9/10 for the graphics. > > Now, onto the important (for me) stuff. > > The physics are one hell of an improvement over the rotating on axis stuff > that we were given in the previous CMR series. The car obviously has > independent suspension, and each wheel is modeled independently in real > time. However, the physics model has been "dampered" for lack of a better > word, for all the gamers out there who would otherwise give up after 30 > minutes of trying and take the game back for a refund. > > I understand the business model for CMR 4, and that hard core sim racers > form a very small (and unprofitable) minority of the players. There is

also > the issue of having a common code base across platforms, where mostconsole

Quoted text (11 lines)

> (xbox - Ps/2) users wouldn't have the controls necessary for a sharp and > accurate driving model. Having said that, it would be nice if the full > release for PC has some type of advanced driving mode. As such, I'll still > be waiting for Richard Burns Rally to meet the sim racers' needs. > > Onto some specifics. > > The single demo car (4WD Citroen) does hanndle something like a 4WD rally > car - that is heaps of understeer unless you put the boot in or scando it > into corners (flick the wrong way then over correct into the corner). The > throttle off oversteer is also there, but is just too predictable and

easy. > Basically, alsmost any curve greater than a "2" can be taken by not even > touching the brakes but simply turning in early and at the same timebacking > off the throttle to push the weight forward and induce oversteer. > Controlling the car then is a simply 10-20 degrees of opposite lockthrough

Quoted text (9 lines)

> the corner, or a 4 wheel drift through the tighter corners. IMHO this is > just way too easy to do and is not challenging nor realistic. > > The tight corners and hairpins can either be taken easily with full > understeer (the slow way), or by braking earlier, changing down to 1st or > 2nd and putting on full throttle before the apex to do a nice slide around > the corner. Again, this technique has been "dumded" down for the game. In > real life, full throttle all the way around the corner would produce an > instant spin - judicious application of the throttle is required to

balance > the car. > > One of the biggest dissapointments is the lack of throttle control. Mostof

Quoted text (20 lines)

> the time, suddenly applying full throttle does nothing more than make the > car go faster, even when cornering. There is no sense of wheelspin or the > resultant slide, much less being able to feel which wheel(s) are spinning > and resultant behaviour. > > At least CMR 4 is good enough to teach the non-sim racer (read: average > game) the basics of oversteer and understeer - this is required for fast > times. Hopefully, it may give them an incentive to move up to the > (hopefully) more realistic Richard Burns Rally when it is released. > > > Summary: > > In summary, the demo is worth a download (if you have broadband). The wet > road of Japan is by far the most realistic and fun of the stages > > As mentioned at the start, I'm being harsh as I'm wearing my "Sim racer" > hat. For the gamers that enjoyed CMR 3, this is by far the biggest > improvement of the series and finally offers something approaching the > physics of an actual car. Combined with the incredible graphics, it is

sure > to be a best seller and I'm sure will get rave reviews in the gamingpress. > > As for me, I won't delete it immediately as I did with the CMR 3 demo, but > will keep playing it a bit to keep me occupied until RBR comes out in afew > months. > > >

On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 06:50:25 GMT, "Charlie B" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Well I'd like to try it but when i choose TWO axis 2 BUTTON Joystick I'm >forced to assign more that 2 buttons worth of controls which my wheel doesnt >have. lol. I cant assign the other controls: handbrake, camera view and >whatever else to the keyboard so I can select accept. >Let me know if I'm missing something. Just push the down arrow until accept is highlighted and press enter. I just tested it, and you can advance to the next screen without having every function mapped to a joystick button. Jason

On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:26:40 GMT, "eppy" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Hi, here's my review of CMR 4 after a couple of hours at the wheel. Good review, about the same way I feel about it. I think the Xbox and PC versions are supposed to retail for $20, so I may get the full version to hold me over until RBR comes out in May. The graphics/sound/etc are awesome and the physics are somewhat convincing while being way too forgiving. Definitely miles better than CMR2 or 3. I hate short stages, but it seems they've taken some time to make them interesitng this year. I actually am starting to get my hopes up a little for Race Driver 2 now, as Codemasters has indicated that they want to start building their games (basically everything after CMR4) from a sim-oriented standpoint with the default aids/etc geared towards a casual player. Supposedly PRD2 was influenced heavily by Live For Speed, so I guess we'll see. I can't wait for RBR. I think it's going to be better than most of us imagine. Jason

Here is mine, - I haven't been able to make my tsw work - Tons of shortcuts ( i can't beleive Codemasters haven't learned from CMR2 ) With a nice damage engine like that how come i don't get any flat or heavy suspension damage when i cut. Sadly this issue will make the game unplayable in a competitive online environment. - Nice graphics. i have only driven on stage has i could barely drive with my controller. EL "eppy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Q4R_b.145167$[email hidden]...

Quoted text (28 lines)

> Hi, here's my review of CMR 4 after a couple of hours at the wheel. > > Firstly, I'm from a rallying background, so I'm biased towards the "sim" > i.e. physics, realism side of things. I was a regular Rally Trophy online > racer for a couple of years. I also drove an escort and Golf at the club > rally level for 10 years. > > As others have mentioned, the graphics are outstanding! For the first time > ever on a computer, when I was driving on a gravel section and got some > splotches of dust/mud on the windscreen (before Colin kindly flicked his > wipers to get rid of them within the arc of the wiper blades), I actually > shook my head for a moment and did a double take to check that I wasn't > watching a video of a real scene. Other attention to detail includes the > damage model, and small things like the tyre marks left on the road, and > especially on the muddy sections. I think Richard Burns Rally will have a > hard time beating this aspect of CMR 3. 9/10 for the graphics. > > Now, onto the important (for me) stuff. > > The physics are one hell of an improvement over the rotating on axis stuff > that we were given in the previous CMR series. The car obviously has > independent suspension, and each wheel is modeled independently in real > time. However, the physics model has been "dampered" for lack of a better > word, for all the gamers out there who would otherwise give up after 30 > minutes of trying and take the game back for a refund. > > I understand the business model for CMR 4, and that hard core sim racers > form a very small (and unprofitable) minority of the players. There is

also > the issue of having a common code base across platforms, where mostconsole

Quoted text (11 lines)

> (xbox - Ps/2) users wouldn't have the controls necessary for a sharp and > accurate driving model. Having said that, it would be nice if the full > release for PC has some type of advanced driving mode. As such, I'll still > be waiting for Richard Burns Rally to meet the sim racers' needs. > > Onto some specifics. > > The single demo car (4WD Citroen) does hanndle something like a 4WD rally > car - that is heaps of understeer unless you put the boot in or scando it > into corners (flick the wrong way then over correct into the corner). The > throttle off oversteer is also there, but is just too predictable and

easy. > Basically, alsmost any curve greater than a "2" can be taken by not even > touching the brakes but simply turning in early and at the same timebacking > off the throttle to push the weight forward and induce oversteer. > Controlling the car then is a simply 10-20 degrees of opposite lockthrough

Quoted text (9 lines)

> the corner, or a 4 wheel drift through the tighter corners. IMHO this is > just way too easy to do and is not challenging nor realistic. > > The tight corners and hairpins can either be taken easily with full > understeer (the slow way), or by braking earlier, changing down to 1st or > 2nd and putting on full throttle before the apex to do a nice slide around > the corner. Again, this technique has been "dumded" down for the game. In > real life, full throttle all the way around the corner would produce an > instant spin - judicious application of the throttle is required to

balance > the car. > > One of the biggest dissapointments is the lack of throttle control. Mostof

Quoted text (20 lines)

> the time, suddenly applying full throttle does nothing more than make the > car go faster, even when cornering. There is no sense of wheelspin or the > resultant slide, much less being able to feel which wheel(s) are spinning > and resultant behaviour. > > At least CMR 4 is good enough to teach the non-sim racer (read: average > game) the basics of oversteer and understeer - this is required for fast > times. Hopefully, it may give them an incentive to move up to the > (hopefully) more realistic Richard Burns Rally when it is released. > > > Summary: > > In summary, the demo is worth a download (if you have broadband). The wet > road of Japan is by far the most realistic and fun of the stages > > As mentioned at the start, I'm being harsh as I'm wearing my "Sim racer" > hat. For the gamers that enjoyed CMR 3, this is by far the biggest > improvement of the series and finally offers something approaching the > physics of an actual car. Combined with the incredible graphics, it is

sure > to be a best seller and I'm sure will get rave reviews in the gamingpress. > > As for me, I won't delete it immediately as I did with the CMR 3 demo, but > will keep playing it a bit to keep me occupied until RBR comes out in afew > months. > > >

A couple of points on this. The "off" sections of the track have been made "sticky" - in that they slow the car down. Watch your tacho as you on any surface off the road - you won't accelerate much, and can even slow you down. Try this on the Japan course: About halfway through, there is a section with a right "3" curve that has a muddy inside area that you can drive on to cut the corner. Notice that if you do so, it will dramatically slow you down - more so than taking the long and tight way around on the tarmac. You'll also notice this effect on many of the open sections of ground in the USA and Finland stages. This isn't realistic of course. I would much prefer if these surfaces had their actual minimal grip, with the result of making the car very difficult to control, especially each side of the car was on a different surface. However, I gather that all the spins would be too much for the causual gamer. The nett result is that there isn't a lot of time to be gained by shortcutting everywhere. After playing the demo for a while in my usual flat out, sideways style, I decided to treat it like a racing track to test the driving physics, and took careful racing lines around the circuit, never going off the road and trying not to slide at all. I was shocked to see the red "ghost" car of my best time only a couple of seconds ahead most of the way. I had expected that I would have been at least 30 seconds slower driving like this. There is one outstanding problem that will show up in online racing - the problem of rail-riding. Much time can be gained on the hairpins where there is Armco by deliberatly driving the car flat out along armco around the corner. Even in the heavy damage mode, there is little more damage than a few sparks. This was a big problem with Rally Trophy. The enthusiasts wrote some cheat checking code for the online hotlapping times, to disqualify any run that had a car against the armco for more than a second. With online play, the replays could be saved and viewed by all competitors, and anyone rail-riding would be disqualified and most likely kicked/banned. This whole issue has been played out to death over the years and will rear its head again when the more serious Richard Burns Rally comes out. What I'm hoping is that the damage model on that Sim will be so good that drivers will be able to shortcut if they wish, but the risks will outweigh the benefits. This is as it is in the real world. Some people have argued that in the real world, rally drivers can cut corners through the forest if they want to take the risk. I agree with this as long as the driving skill required and damage model make the risk the same in a good sim (not talking about CMR here) as it is in the real world. Consider the big boulder near the start of the USA stage. Of course its much quicker to go the wrong side of it. If I was driving my rally car on that stage, I'd the same thing as long as it was in the rules. Tim "Eric Leblanc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:WV5%b.133903$[email hidden]... > Here is mine, > > - I haven't been able to make my tsw work > - Tons of shortcuts ( i can't beleive Codemasters haven't learned from > CMR2 ) With a nice damage engine like that how come i don't get any flator

Quoted text (13 lines)

> heavy suspension damage when i cut. Sadly this issue will make the game > unplayable in a competitive online environment. > - Nice graphics. > > i have only driven on stage has i could barely drive with my controller. > > EL > "eppy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Q4R_b.145167$[email hidden]... > > Hi, here's my review of CMR 4 after a couple of hours at the wheel. > > > > Firstly, I'm from a rallying background, so I'm biased towards the "sim" > > i.e. physics, realism side of things. I was a regular Rally Trophy

online > > racer for a couple of years. I also drove an escort and Golf at the club > > rally level for 10 years. > > > > As others have mentioned, the graphics are outstanding! For the firsttime > > ever on a computer, when I was driving on a gravel section and got some > > splotches of dust/mud on the windscreen (before Colin kindly flicked his > > wipers to get rid of them within the arc of the wiper blades), Iactually > > shook my head for a moment and did a double take to check that I wasn't > > watching a video of a real scene. Other attention to detail includes the > > damage model, and small things like the tyre marks left on the road, and > > especially on the muddy sections. I think Richard Burns Rally will havea > > hard time beating this aspect of CMR 3. 9/10 for the graphics. > > > > Now, onto the important (for me) stuff. > > > > The physics are one hell of an improvement over the rotating on axisstuff > > that we were given in the previous CMR series. The car obviously has > > independent suspension, and each wheel is modeled independently in real > > time. However, the physics model has been "dampered" for lack of abetter

Quoted text (11 lines)

> > word, for all the gamers out there who would otherwise give up after 30 > > minutes of trying and take the game back for a refund. > > > > I understand the business model for CMR 4, and that hard core sim racers > > form a very small (and unprofitable) minority of the players. There is > also > > the issue of having a common code base across platforms, where most > console > > (xbox - Ps/2) users wouldn't have the controls necessary for a sharp and > > accurate driving model. Having said that, it would be nice if the full > > release for PC has some type of advanced driving mode. As such, I'll

still > > be waiting for Richard Burns Rally to meet the sim racers' needs. > > > > Onto some specifics. > > > > The single demo car (4WD Citroen) does hanndle something like a 4WDrally > > car - that is heaps of understeer unless you put the boot in or scandoit > > into corners (flick the wrong way then over correct into the corner).The

Quoted text (13 lines)

> > throttle off oversteer is also there, but is just too predictable and > easy. > > Basically, alsmost any curve greater than a "2" can be taken by not even > > touching the brakes but simply turning in early and at the same time > backing > > off the throttle to push the weight forward and induce oversteer. > > Controlling the car then is a simply 10-20 degrees of opposite lock > through > > the corner, or a 4 wheel drift through the tighter corners. IMHO this is > > just way too easy to do and is not challenging nor realistic. > > > > The tight corners and hairpins can either be taken easily with full > > understeer (the slow way), or by braking earlier, changing down to 1st

or > > 2nd and putting on full throttle before the apex to do a nice slidearound > > the corner. Again, this technique has been "dumded" down for the game.In

Quoted text (8 lines)

> > real life, full throttle all the way around the corner would produce an > > instant spin - judicious application of the throttle is required to > balance > > the car. > > > > One of the biggest dissapointments is the lack of throttle control. Most > of > > the time, suddenly applying full throttle does nothing more than make

the > > car go faster, even when cornering. There is no sense of wheelspin orthe > > resultant slide, much less being able to feel which wheel(s) arespinning

Quoted text (11 lines)

> > and resultant behaviour. > > > > At least CMR 4 is good enough to teach the non-sim racer (read: average > > game) the basics of oversteer and understeer - this is required for fast > > times. Hopefully, it may give them an incentive to move up to the > > (hopefully) more realistic Richard Burns Rally when it is released. > > > > > > Summary: > > > > In summary, the demo is worth a download (if you have broadband). The

wet

Quoted text (11 lines)

> > road of Japan is by far the most realistic and fun of the stages > > > > As mentioned at the start, I'm being harsh as I'm wearing my "Sim racer" > > hat. For the gamers that enjoyed CMR 3, this is by far the biggest > > improvement of the series and finally offers something approaching the > > physics of an actual car. Combined with the incredible graphics, it is > sure > > to be a best seller and I'm sure will get rave reviews in the gaming > press. > > > > As for me, I won't delete it immediately as I did with the CMR 3 demo,

but

Quoted text (8 lines)

> > will keep playing it a bit to keep me occupied until RBR comes out in a > few > > months. > > > > > > > >

nope, w/o assigning them the accept button is greyed out. Its a 2 button tsw2. "Jason Moyer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > Just push the down arrow until accept is highlighted and press enter. > I just tested it, and you can advance to the next screen without > having every function mapped to a joystick button. > > Jason

"eppy" <[email hidden]> kirjoitti viestiss� news:kf8%b.150665$[email hidden]... ... > > This isn't realistic of course. I would much prefer if these surfaces had > their actual minimal grip, with the result of making the car verydifficult > to control, especially each side of the car was on a different surface. > However, I gather that all the spins would be too much for the causual > gamer. Spins? What spins? Have you actually spinned the car in the demo? I don't think it's possible... a even the slightest hint of an opposite lock will straighten the car. As I recall, Rally Championship 2000 had this sort of "sticky grass" too, but after a while (enought ppl complained I guess) they made a patch that enabled the user to remove it. I doubt that Codemasters could be bothered... > The nett result is that there isn't a lot of time to be gained by > shortcutting everywhere. After playing the demo for a while in my usualflat > out, sideways style, I decided to treat it like a racing track to test the > driving physics, and took careful racing lines around the circuit, never > going off the road and trying not to slide at all. I was shocked to seethe > red "ghost" car of my best time only a couple of seconds ahead most of the > way. I had expected that I would have been at least 30 seconds slower > driving like this. I.e. deformable surface isn't modelled. It's just a slippery tarmac-like surface that looks like gravel. This is the case in most (all?) rally games. This is probably why the stage in Japan feels better (more realistic driving experience) than the other two. Anyway, I was positively surprised by this demo. Not that I had high expectations... didn't have any actually. It's certainly not a serious sim, but the fun factor pretty high, IMO.

On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:38:09 -0500, Eric Leblanc wrote: > Here is mine, > > - I haven't been able to make my tsw work Gameport version? I cannot believe they screwed this up again at codies. I haven't seen a single title from them what would work out of the box on my trusty TSW2 (never had that kind of problem with Papy or newer ISI titles). uwe -- mail replies to Uwe at schuerkamp dot de ( yahoo address is spambox) Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

I never got to try the demo. lol. all becuase of the game forcing me to assign controls to buttons that I dont have. I mean if Im using a 2 axis 2 button joystick (TSW2) how can the pile of sh!t force me to assign controls to it besides up/down shift. blah. "Uwe Sch�rkamp" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted text (17 lines)

> On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:38:09 -0500, Eric Leblanc wrote: > > Here is mine, > > > > - I haven't been able to make my tsw work > > Gameport version? I cannot believe they screwed this up again at > codies. I haven't seen a single title from them what would work out of > the box on my trusty TSW2 (never had that kind of problem with Papy > or newer ISI titles). > > uwe > > -- > mail replies to Uwe at schuerkamp dot de ( yahoo address is spambox) > Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ > Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) > GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61