Personal opinion of NasRev Demo and N99

Let's get some REAL comparisons going. Both programs have good and bad points. Both will have their market and both will sell well. Here's __MY__ personal opinion of what the perfect sim would add: A visible flagger. How many WC cars have a flag waving in their windshield? An animated pit crew. NasRev's is fun to watch, but I'd want to see it from INSIDE the car! A visible tow truck. Track cleanup that is animated. After a wreck, tow trucks should come out, speedi-dry should be laid out, etc. You should be able to see this happen as you went under yellow. Cars should be on the track until they're TOWED out, not just disappear. Black flag OPTION for bad sportsmanship. Should be able to turn off while learning, but when you're at a certain level, you should be able to turn it on. This would help make you even MORE careful as you would in real life. Crowd noise!! (but then I guess the drivers can't really hear us, can they?) A crew chief who more accurately sets up your car. I doubt DW et al, define their own air pressure or spring rate! Ability to jump INTO any car during replay to see how THEY took a line around. I want to see when they brake/slow... Fire..., flips. Comparison of not only the LAST lap, but your BEST lap. Both displayable simultaneously (N1 had this). I like NasRev's drive-by intro (course you gotta be able to toggle it OFF, too), the sounds are better, the graphics are pretty good but I don't seem to get the same sensation of speed. But then, I'll be first in line for Nascar3, too. I love the Nascar 1/2/3 series and will continue to support it as long as they add improvements. NasRev will be interesting to see in its final form - 2 months is a LONG time to developers. Don Hancock "Gunner"

Come on....forget all of the EYE CANDY and let's get to work on the actual physics of the cars to be more realistic. Aaron

Didn't the NasRev have a virus? Or has that been cleaned up? ===================== =====================

windshield? Will agree with you on that. I had the same idea, but however it really isn't neccesary. All it would do is take more time for the graphics to proccess. Once again, read above. Once again, read above. life. Mixed feelings about this one. they?) I think drivers can hear the crowd, but once again not neccesary in the big picture. A "virtual crew chief" can not give the same quality that learning setups on your own is. However, it'd still be a good feature to consider. That I'd really like to see. Sorta like the Tabasco Telemtry on ESPN, eh? We will see flips in NASCAR 3. No fire though, and I will have to agree I support that decision. I mean, yeah, you'll see fires happen every season, but none of them are really big enough to cause MUCH concern. Some good ideas. Yep. NasRev, while it is going to be an arcade game, will still be interesting to see. -- Travis Kallner mknight98 on TEN ICQ#23206113 Driver of the #15 Chevrolet Monte Carlo in N.A.O.R. and O.R.S.A. Team 15 Motorsports http://members.tripod.com/~modernknight98/

On Mon, 14 Dec 1998 16:31:13 -0500, "Aaron M."

Quoted text (11 lines)

>>A visible flagger. How many WC cars have a flag waving in their windshield? >>An animated pit crew. NasRev's is fun to watch, but I'd want to see it from >>INSIDE the car! >>A visible tow truck. >>Track cleanup that is animated. After a wreck, tow trucks should come out, >>speedi-dry should be laid out, etc. You should be able to see this happen >>as you went under yellow. Cars should be on the track until they're TOWED >>out, not just disappear. >Come on....forget all of the EYE CANDY and let's get to work on the actual >physics of the cars to be more realistic.

Agreed. There are plenty of games out there...enough already. Mike

>On Mon, 14 Dec 1998 16:31:13 -0500, "Aaron M." >>>A visible flagger. How many WC cars have a flag waving in their windshield? >>>An animated pit crew. NasRev's is fun to watch, but I'd want to see it from >>>INSIDE the car! >>>A visible tow truck. >>>Track cleanup that is animated. After a wreck, tow trucks should come out, >>>speedi-dry should be laid out, etc. You should be able to see this happen >>>as you went under yellow. Cars should be on the track until they're TOWED

Quoted text (7 lines)

>>>out, not just disappear. >>Come on....forget all of the EYE CANDY and let's get to work on the actual >>physics of the cars to be more realistic. >Agreed. There are plenty of games out there...enough already. >Mike

C'mon, here. My point is that surely, with all the "eye candy" they can get into a flight sim (look at F-15 or Falcon 4, or JSF) surely we can have BOTH. I, too, think realism should see a lot of the efforts, but there are many other things that contribute to the "suspension of reality" that I (at least) crave. Don Hancock "Gunner"

Yes Don, I agree. Once we have the model and the FR to use it, then we can spend time making eye candy. I always over react to this issue because I don't want the few good developers to 'sell out' to the eye candy crowd. There are plenty of graphically pretty 'games' around, but only a few simulators. If I might quote a flight-sim term, MMSC - Multi-Million dollar Simulator in a Can. That is what we WBRDs (Wanna Be Race car Driver) desire in a product. Mike

OK, Lets assume the physics modelling from Papy will kick ass. Here are some things that I like about Revolution that are missing from N2. 1) More control over pitting Revolution takes over control of the car when entering the pit. This means you won't get black flagged for racing though the pit, but you do get the chance to pick pit options from the menu. To me this seems like a reasonable compromise. Now if they would add the ability to split pitting up during yellow flags so that I could stay on the lead lap, that would be something. 2) Split times, I love 'em 3) "Speed shot view" No car, just guages. This was about the only thing I liked about CPR, talk about a sense of speed! I feel like I'm strapped to the hood of the car. 4) Eye candy. Lets face it, with todays hardware, there is no reason not to have super wizz bag 3d acclerated dynamic light sourcing fog effects mip mapping(you get the idea). PROVIDED it is not done at the expense of accurately modelling Nascar Racing. Competition is good, umkay my 2 cents

How about just good old ease of use? I've only been lurking here for about two weeks (since I got seriously into NASCAR 2/99), but I have been a NASCAR fan for every and can hold my own with computers. I have already went through that stage where I like to see parts of my computer spread out all across the room and where if I even hear that some new "stuff" might be out there I grab my checkbook (I've advanced to credit cards now) and run to the store. I am a NASCAR fan and I want entertainment from these programs (whether of the sim or game variety) And the opportunity to come a little closer to participating in a sport I love so much. I want to spend my time getting just that right setup at The Rock in order to shave a tenth of a second off my time--not trying to figure out why the hell the graphics are different from yesterday, or adjusting this to 50% and that to 22.5% in order to get the right sound! The Sierra Utilities screwed my entire system the first time I tried to update NASCAR 2 a few months ago. What the hell?! Sure tech. support got me through it. It was prompt, only cost me a couple of bucks on the phone, etc., but damn! I want to race, not***around with a substandard (and it is substandard compared to the thousands of $s worth of other software that I own/have owned) program. Yes, I love the program. I will continue to use NASCAR (2/50th/99) and I will buy 3/2000 when it come out--but because it is NASCAR, not because I am a fan of Sierra (They just seem to market all the games I love!). Just my 2 cents! -- Hitler Started with Gun Control Too! >OK, >Lets assume the physics modelling from Papy will kick ass. Here are some things >that I like about Revolution that are missing from N2. >1) More control over pitting >Revolution takes over control of the car when entering the pit. This means you >won't get black flagged for racing though the pit, but you do get the chance to >pick pit options from the menu. To me this seems like a reasonable compromise. >Now if they would add the ability to split pitting up during yellow flags so >that I could stay on the lead lap, that would be something. >2) Split times, I love 'em >3) "Speed shot view" No car, just guages. This was about the only thing I liked >about CPR, talk about a sense of speed! I feel like I'm strapped to the hood of >the car. >4) Eye candy. Lets face it, with todays hardware, there is no reason not to have >super wizz bag 3d acclerated dynamic light sourcing fog effects mip mapping(you >get the idea). PROVIDED it is not done at the expense of accurately modelling >Nascar Racing. >Competition is good, umkay >my 2 cents