N3: what the &%_#$#* am I doing wrong???

Okay, after two weeks of playing Nascar 3 I finally know how to keep going along with the AI (still at 99%). 'Along' is the right word, because I got a problem. HOW do you overtake cars in Nascar racing? Yes, by racing faster and using draft and timing the move. But whatever I do I ALWAYS get kicked of the track (I usually drive 10% races and only ONCE i finished without being hit badly). There is always some moron that doesn't care I'm besides him and he just pushes me off (and drives along as if nothing has happened). I found out (I think) that when you overtake a car on a straight your hood has to be before his hood before you enter a corner or he will ignore and ram you. And when you overtake in a corner: if you can still see a bit of the car you overtake out off the front window just before you get on the straight you better slow down and let him go or he'll just ruin your race. And WHEN you slow down, being carefull, you lose speed and other cars pass you again. Anyway, this way I can never ever get a nice final position unless I start from pole and keep it that way. Maybe I got a wrong idea about this Nascar thing. How do you guys approach a race? Do you try to overtake other cars or do you just drive 30 laps before someone makes a mistake and you can pass him? It's not nice when you NEVER (well, once...) finish a race without being smashed and lapped... Jeroen :-(

Hahahah sorry i gott larf you sound well frustrated.... keep t it m8, im like the same in GPL i find it reall hard to outbrake anyone they are all the last of the late brakers..basstuds ill ave em. Im a demon on corners but just not fast into em. Try being more forceful let em have it!

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>Okay, after two weeks of playing Nascar 3 I finally know how to keep going >along with the AI (still at 99%). 'Along' is the right word, because I got a >problem. HOW do you overtake cars in Nascar racing? Yes, by racing faster >and using draft and timing the move. But whatever I do I ALWAYS get kicked >of the track (I usually drive 10% races and only ONCE i finished without >being hit badly). There is always some moron that doesn't care I'm besides >him and he just pushes me off (and drives along as if nothing has happened). >I found out (I think) that when you overtake a car on a straight your hood >has to be before his hood before you enter a corner or he will ignore and >ram you. And when you overtake in a corner: if you can still see a bit of >the car you overtake out off the front window just before you get on the >straight you better slow down and let him go or he'll just ruin your race. >And WHEN you slow down, being carefull, you lose speed and other cars pass >you again. Anyway, this way I can never ever get a nice final position >unless I start from pole and keep it that way. >Maybe I got a wrong idea about this Nascar thing. How do you guys approach a >race? Do you try to overtake other cars or do you just drive 30 laps before >someone makes a mistake and you can pass him? It's not nice when you NEVER >(well, once...) finish a race without being smashed and lapped... >Jeroen :-(

I usually start my AI races from the back. I used to blast up the pack as fast as I could on the first lap. Usually resulted in a wreck, if not in turn 1, it would be in turn 3. A good rule of thumb that I use for online races and offline races, is not to pass the car infront of me until I exit off the turn 2. Stay in your lane. In the first few laps at most tracks being able to hold your line is real critical. Once you get spread out, then you have to be quite aggressive and bold. Set the car up for the pass. Don't be afraid to get in close. And know where and where not to pass on each track you race. If you keep getting pushed into the wall on the exit of the turns, don't go there. If your having problems passing on the entrances of the corners, try making your passes on the exits. Enter the corner alittle higher/slower and exit lower (Late apex). Try to stay away from passing on the outside, even though, your still going to have to do it. When passing on the outside, plan ahead. Where is the AI going to be on the exit in relation to you, Are you going to exit side-by-side? Adjust the AI skill level to be actually difficult to race against. I have found for me, that AI's that are not at my pace, cause more passing headaches. I have had to adjust AI levels for each track when learning. Try riding the bumper of an AI car that is slower then you. Don't take him out, just ride his bumper for a few laps. This will help on where you are strong and they are week. Plan on setups for where you plan to run most of your race. I find that a loose setup, maybe the fastest and great for a start from the top10. But, that same setup, will be a handleful if having to race in traffic for the entire race. And most of all....Keep with it. It will come. Thad

Actually when the spotter says Car High is when that car will know you are takin' a look down there. I've noticed that's the point where a car will give up the line. 'Course once you take that low line you've got to hold it. Not even the AI will let you wash up without ringin' your bell! -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------ Speed Is Good Only When Wisdom Leads The Way ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------ Mark McCuen/#35 Hooters Monte Carlo/HAL Series www.hooters-racing.com

> There is always some moron that doesn't care I'm besides > him and he just pushes me off (and drives along as if nothing has happened).<snip!> Unfortunately, every sim has patterns that the AI follow, some sims hide the patterns better than others, but after a bit of watching you might be able to pick out the pattern. Knowing that there is 'some rhyme or reason', you can experiment. Run some race laps at whatever track you want to compete at. Take note where the AI comes down and punts you. It was really prevelant in N2, but not so bad now, but usually you can find about 3 spots in every lap where you JUST should NOT BE if there is AI near. It ain't realistic I know, but if you are running a long race you will survive much longer if you just don't allow yourself to become a deer in the headlights of the AI. At some point on most corners, they are gonna take the apex. ONLY if you have forced them up and away BEFORE the corner will you be safe. :)(sounds like Doom tactics) So learning a track means understanding the groove that allows you to drive fast but also learning means figuring out where those dang AI are gonna bite. And remember, the last setting in the driver.txt file controls track aggression, #3 is far more likely to get physical than say #22. Adios! dave henrie

I might suggest working on your qualifying more. Things are much easier running from up front! If you're only running 10% races, you'll probably only need to make very few passes at all and only on the smaller venues like Bristol. It should make your racing experience much less frustrating, and still give some measure of passing practice. Good Luck!! Jeroen wrote:

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> Okay, after two weeks of playing Nascar 3 I finally know how to keep going > along with the AI (still at 99%). 'Along' is the right word, because I got a > problem. HOW do you overtake cars in Nascar racing? Yes, by racing faster > and using draft and timing the move. But whatever I do I ALWAYS get kicked > of the track (I usually drive 10% races and only ONCE i finished without > being hit badly). There is always some moron that doesn't care I'm besides > him and he just pushes me off (and drives along as if nothing has happened). > I found out (I think) that when you overtake a car on a straight your hood > has to be before his hood before you enter a corner or he will ignore and > ram you. And when you overtake in a corner: if you can still see a bit of > the car you overtake out off the front window just before you get on the > straight you better slow down and let him go or he'll just ruin your race. > And WHEN you slow down, being carefull, you lose speed and other cars pass > you again. Anyway, this way I can never ever get a nice final position > unless I start from pole and keep it that way. > > Maybe I got a wrong idea about this Nascar thing. How do you guys approach a > race? Do you try to overtake other cars or do you just drive 30 laps before > someone makes a mistake and you can pass him? It's not nice when you NEVER > (well, once...) finish a race without being smashed and lapped... > > Jeroen :-(

-- Chuck Kandler #70 ChuckK on Won.net K&S Racing http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/thepits/195 The box said "Windows 95 or better", so I installed LINUX!

>I might suggest working on your qualifying more. Things are much easierrunning >from up front! If you're only running 10% races, you'll probably only needto >make very few passes at all and only on the smaller venues like Bristol.It >should make your racing experience much less frustrating, and still givesome >measure of passing practice. > But isn't it boring then? At most tracks, the AI seems to be much more competitive in qualification than in race. I succeeded winning races starting from 10+ qualifying positions and finally running those lonely laps I know from VIPER RACING, which I tried to avoid running NASCAR with up to 43 cars (well... I admit, in the GT level of Viper I don't run those lonely laps at the top...). Sure you got to get used to the AI breaking and accelarating at different points than you, but that is one of the challenges of this game: to react on the AI as the AI reacts on you (and really it does!!). CU Zolli

Agreed. For you and I this may very well be the case. For someone getting frustrated with the sim for the reasons he states, my approach would probably work well. For one thing, setup knowledge will increase dramatically, and also good qualifying will be key should he ever want to do any multiplayer. It cannot hurt him, and may well make him more satisfied with his sim experience. Zolli wrote:

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> >I might suggest working on your qualifying more. Things are much easier > running > >from up front! If you're only running 10% races, you'll probably only need > to > >make very few passes at all and only on the smaller venues like Bristol. > It > >should make your racing experience much less frustrating, and still give > some > >measure of passing practice. > > > > But isn't it boring then? > At most tracks, the AI seems to be much more competitive in qualification > than in race. I succeeded winning races starting from 10+ qualifying > positions and finally running those lonely laps I know from VIPER RACING, > which I tried to avoid running NASCAR with up to 43 cars (well... I admit, > in the GT level of Viper I don't run those lonely laps at the top...). > Sure you got to get used to the AI breaking and accelarating at different > points than you, but that is one of the challenges of this game: to react on > the AI as the AI reacts on you (and really it does!!). > > CU > Zolli

-- Chuck Kandler #70 ChuckK on Won.net K&S Racing http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/thepits/195 The box said "Windows 95 or better", so I installed LINUX!

Don't make the same mistake as I did. I figured this... If I put the AI at 90% and qualify last, I'll be able to practice a LOT of overtakes, right? Wrong! Sure, there are 40 cars to overtake at first and then you just lap them and do it again etc etc. Problem is that at 90% you just drive past them. Bye bye! Just like that. But now, with AI at 100% it's a knife fight in a phone booth with every friggen' car! Overtakes don't take 2 seconds, they might take 20 laps, very careful planing and there's NO room for mistakes on your part. Start practicing with as high AI as you dare. /petern

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>I might suggest working on your qualifying more. Things are much easier running >from up front! If you're only running 10% races, you'll probably only need to >make very few passes at all and only on the smaller venues like Bristol. It >should make your racing experience much less frustrating, and still give some >measure of passing practice. >Good Luck!! >> Okay, after two weeks of playing Nascar 3 I finally know how to keep going >> along with the AI (still at 99%). 'Along' is the right word, because I got a >> problem. HOW do you overtake cars in Nascar racing? Yes, by racing faster >> and using draft and timing the move. But whatever I do I ALWAYS get kicked >> of the track (I usually drive 10% races and only ONCE i finished without >> being hit badly). There is always some moron that doesn't care I'm besides >> him and he just pushes me off (and drives along as if nothing has happened). >> I found out (I think) that when you overtake a car on a straight your hood >> has to be before his hood before you enter a corner or he will ignore and >> ram you. And when you overtake in a corner: if you can still see a bit of >> the car you overtake out off the front window just before you get on the >> straight you better slow down and let him go or he'll just ruin your race. >> And WHEN you slow down, being carefull, you lose speed and other cars pass >> you again. Anyway, this way I can never ever get a nice final position >> unless I start from pole and keep it that way. >> Maybe I got a wrong idea about this Nascar thing. How do you guys approach a >> race? Do you try to overtake other cars or do you just drive 30 laps before >> someone makes a mistake and you can pass him? It's not nice when you NEVER >> (well, once...) finish a race without being smashed and lapped... >> Jeroen :-(

Well, thanks for the tips, guys. I just did a 10% race with AI at 99% at Indianapolis. Took the qual setup to qual to get a better position and became 20th. Wow! :-) Anyway, this way I had some competition around me right from the start: I wasn't looking at the back of the pack. I also took the sticker 'Patience' seriously (didn't rush into every bit of spave I saw) and had a lot of help from McCuen's tip that when the spotter says 'Car high or low' this also means that the car you want to overtake means you are there! So when I almost entered a corner or exited one during a overtake manouvre, and I didn't hear the spotter say 'Car etc!' I backed off. Well, this helped! I became 11th! Yeah, not nr. 1 yet, but I had a great time: 16 laps of continuing battle against the AI! I had my share of luck (hit a car once but bounced well against the wall and I slipped a little in a corner but luckily the AI missed me...), but this was great. Now I'm getting to like the game! Hope I'm just as positive tomorrow after the next race... :-) Jeroen

Try 100% racing Jeroen... so you got time to sit on someone's "behind" for a couple of laps before deciding to make a move. As a rule, don't go for an "iffy" pass with more than 50 to go. Find a quick driver you can follow with ease, but would have trouble passing and shadow him. In Nascar99 I spent more laps just "hanging" with T. Labonte than I care to mention. Use tactics... in spite of the "finding IQ's with a shovel"-image the Winston Cup racing is a thinking man's series. Jan./ a top 10 finish (100% AI / 100% distance) at The Brickyard so far.