GPL - The head thing

Okay, I can put together a reasonably quick lap, even a series of them, but there's always, in a race, when I make that one mistake. And, of course, one mistake is all it takes. You're gone. You're leading, or challenging, and suddenly, a stupid, stupid mistake, and you're gone. It's a head thing. It's a lapse in concentration. It's experimenting during a race. Oh, I'll try braking here, instead. Derrrrr!!!! It's "you can't do that to me", gotta get back in front of him....bang. Tried too hard. It's a lack of patience. It's a head thing. You're in front and you decide to do the fastest lap of the race. Why?...Whyyyyy???? It's a head thing. Is there a patch for this? I've been driving GPL since it came out and I still make these dumb mistakes. I can drive, I know I can. I'm serious. Is there any way to fix this head thing? Study meditation? Hypnotise myself? ***? If anybody out there has a system, a mental system, that helps them to remain focused, to stay cool, to resist that one foolhardy gesture that will cost them the race, send it to me cause I'm getting desperate. roy

: It's a head thing. You're in front and you decide to do the fastest lap : of the race. Why?...Whyyyyy???? : It's a head thing. : Is there a patch for this? Red glasses to filter out the red mist? I do this all the time, usually after 40 minutes at Spa. I always overcook La Source trying to be a hero. Dohh. Stephen

LOL! I could not agree more! Wish I knew the cure. Was this > < far awy from my best lap ever at the Nurburgring and looped it exiting the last corner! I'm going to try putting something soothing like Tibetan monks chanting or whale music on the music box but I doubt it'll compete with the wind up that the engine sound does to me. Good luck on your search :) David

go to [link lost in import: /~richadr/index.html] ricardo has some very good things to say in respect to your problem and its a hell of a gpl site as well

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> Okay, I can put together a reasonably quick lap, even a series of them, > but there's always, in a race, when I make that one mistake. And, of > course, one mistake is all it takes. You're gone. You're leading, or > challenging, and suddenly, a stupid, stupid mistake, and you're gone. > It's a head thing. It's a lapse in concentration. It's experimenting > during a race. Oh, I'll try braking here, instead. Derrrrr!!!! It's "you > can't do that to me", gotta get back in front of him....bang. Tried too > hard. It's a lack of patience. > It's a head thing. You're in front and you decide to do the fastest lap > of the race. Why?...Whyyyyy???? > It's a head thing. > Is there a patch for this? > I've been driving GPL since it came out and I still make these dumb > mistakes. I can drive, I know I can. > I'm serious. Is there any way to fix this head thing? Study meditation? > Hypnotise myself? ***? > If anybody out there has a system, a mental system, that helps them to > remain focused, to stay cool, to resist that one foolhardy gesture that > will cost them the race, send it to me cause I'm getting desperate. > roy

went back and read my message and tried the link . the link didn't work for me so heres another way in [link lost in import] go to her force feedback page look for richard nunnuni page on ff setups at the bottm of richards page is a home button that will take you to the lead page and the entire driving tips section should help you both physically and mentally

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> Okay, I can put together a reasonably quick lap, even a series of them, > but there's always, in a race, when I make that one mistake. And, of > course, one mistake is all it takes. You're gone. You're leading, or > challenging, and suddenly, a stupid, stupid mistake, and you're gone. > It's a head thing. It's a lapse in concentration. It's experimenting > during a race. Oh, I'll try braking here, instead. Derrrrr!!!! It's "you > can't do that to me", gotta get back in front of him....bang. Tried too > hard. It's a lack of patience. > It's a head thing. You're in front and you decide to do the fastest lap > of the race. Why?...Whyyyyy???? > It's a head thing. > Is there a patch for this? > I've been driving GPL since it came out and I still make these dumb > mistakes. I can drive, I know I can. > I'm serious. Is there any way to fix this head thing? Study meditation? > Hypnotise myself? ***? > If anybody out there has a system, a mental system, that helps them to > remain focused, to stay cool, to resist that one foolhardy gesture that > will cost them the race, send it to me cause I'm getting desperate. > roy

I know I'll be checking back to find out this answer too! I can only add my pitiful little insight to my racing-mind wanderings. When I settle down to racing after learning a circuit and developing a setup i look for places I could win the race but more importantly, I look for places I could *lose* the race! For instance Watkins Glen: I can eat everyones lunch coming up the hill through the esses but I can lose the race trying to overtake to the right in the braking zone going into Big Bend. Think about racing in your best areas and surviving your worst corners is the only thing I can pass on. Happy Motoring

I generally race better when I listen to music, it helps with my concentration. I have a audio CD player (extrenal normal audio CD player), that I plug into the audio input on my SBLive, you can use the CD player in your computer, but you'll take a frame rate hit. When I play GPL, I have to turn the music so I can barely hear it over GPL (you don't want it to loud). Also I generally listen to very aggresive music, I think it helps me to remain focused through the whole race.

I hear crawling behind some bushes and crying your eyes out helps clear the head. Sounds like you have a bad case of Mika syndrome to me - which is not necessarily a bad thing <G>. "Buzz O'Dea" wrote

I don't have the big answer on how to keep cool, but since knowing ones problems is the first step towards correcting them, here are two hard to get rid of habits I'm having trouble with: - Ignoring signs of trouble: when slightly on the wrong line etc it's easy to stay flat out hoping to make it anyway (trying to avoid losing a tenth or two) instead of easing off and making it through safely. It works when hotlapping (if you get lucky it will work, if not, just try onother lap). But in racing it is fatal, obviously. - Making up for lost time: after any mistake, it's way to easy to start trying to get the lost time back. In a race, especially an error resulting in being overtaken easily leads to the "damn, must go a bit faster to get my position back" state of mind. More often than not it soon results in another mistake, this time being big enough to lose half a dozen positions. Both problems seem to be based on a problem to focus on the current situation and ignoring the past. In the first case, the new situation is temporary, maybe a slower than usual corner because of a bad entry. Trying to take it at the normal speed is just as risky as taking another corner at a higher than normal speed. In the second case, the new situation is stationary and even harder to accept. In some cases it is worth the increased risk to speed up trying to get the position back, but usually the loss is more an ego problem than a real problem. I'm having no trouble getting this into the thinking parts of my head, the problem is to get it into the parts of it I use when racing... _ Mats Lofkvist

If someone finds out the cure for the sudden rush of *** to the head, please tell Mikka Hakkinen! Seriously, Ive worked for race teams, and real drivers do it too, especially if their team-mate is in front! Dave Woods ------

In GPL or on a real track, it makes no difference, other than costing and hurting a lot less. I have been wrestling with my inner kamikaze for my entire 47yrs. Years ago I cut a quote out of a magazine and put it on my fridge hoping if I read it enough times it would help. It hasn't helped, I'm still a kamikaze, but maybe it will help you. " The key for any kind of winning driving is the ability to concentrate. Because for any kind of race, whether it's a half-hour Player's Challenge or a three hour Indy 500, being able to put the same concentration into every single corner of every lap, every second on the track, is what matters. The guys that don't win races are the ones that can't do it." -- Don Scurlock Vancouver,B.C.

This is the Zone. :) You know your in the Zone when you come out of it,hehe. I find when I'm in intense Concentration time slows down and everything flows together and my surroundings disappear, there are even times in heavy Concentration that many seconds or even whole laps are lost somewhere in the back of my mind, I don't recall running the laps but the times were flowing together, not even a tenth off each other and I have never crashed when in the zone. I found being a Goalie in Hockey for 16 years has helped a lot because being a goalie is 90% mental just like racing and it deals with intense concentration and self control. There are many times in Hockey when I made the save and didn't even recall seeing the puck coming(80+ mph slap shot's from 30 feet out) but the subconscious sees it and made my body reacts with out a visual cue, it's all with intense Concentration. It's the Mental Training that takes the longest to master and it separates the good from the great. This is what I like about racing, it's not the speed or the rush of danger it's the mind games that keep me coming back for more. Thanks for bringing up this subject, Sports Psychology is interesting. :) Alan

A few years ago Nigel Mansell was comfortably leading the British Grand Prix when he suddenly put in the fastest Lap of the race. Asked about it later he said .. "I did it for the fans" Frank Williams wasn't so impressed and gave him a bollocking! -- Craig http://www.btinternet.com/~the.solicitors Great Song Lyrics, No2 Cheap Lovers Make Expensive Wives. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

True Story: Hutchinson Island. 1998. From the start I am pulling away about a half second every lap. (Pit Board reads a second more every other lap). Then at 8 seconds, the seconds stop going up...4 laps later, the time drops to 7. I never slowed down. He just got faster. Pressure is on. I pushed it too hard into the right hander. Spun it into the haybails. Race was over. He won. Pressure SUCKS. I have gradually learned to get rid of it but it is just mental discipline. It is tough to learn. JBlack

>Great post Buzz! Great post, Larry! >I accomplished all three goals and came away with fastest time of the day >(beating my brother which made him nuts). That fastest time came without a >focus on getting the fastest time, which would have brought up all of the >head trips that kill me every time. Sorry about the length here, I just find >this aspect so fascinating and a great metaphor for life I tend to go on a >bit. I have been playing racing sims since F1GP on the Amiga made its appearance, and only went karting (the closest thing to real racing I have done) for the first time in my life a couple of weeks ago. It was fascinating to feel that mental aspect that trying to drive a decent GPL race has on a real track, in a real vehicle at real speed under real G-forces. The same techniques of focusing and determination that GPL coaches you into works on a real track, too. Cheers, Uwe -- Uwe Schuerkamp http://www.schuerkamp.de/ Herford, Germany (52.0N/8h30mE) Ever wondered what's wrong with the world? http://bnetwork.com/ PGP Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

I find I'm at my absolute best when I'm chasing another car. So if there's nobody ahead of me I pretend there really is and that keeps my concentration up. If someone is chasing me I also pretend that I'm trying to catch the imaginary car ahead and that puts some pressure on the driver behind to keep up with me (of course I still have to be ready to defend my line). Also I find that it helps me to remember to keep my focus well ahead of the front of the car and toward the apex *area* rather than the outside of the turn. Notice I emphasized "area". I find if I fixate on the apex itself I generally***up the line through the turn. By keeping my focus on the general area of the apex (but still well ahead of the front of the car) I drive a much better line through the turn. Keep reminding yourself to do this on every lap. It's easy to forget when you're on your own and bored :-) . Note: if one of the imaginary cars swears at you for running him off the road say "sorry".

What about total brain fade? Sometimes (usually late at night) I'll go screaming into a 3rd gear corner at top speed in 6th because I have simply forgotten where I was on the track. Doh. Stephen

Five things; first practise a lot in normal practise mode so you're absolutely sure you're one with the car and the track. Second a real racers thing; I saw Mika and Heinz do it and I do it myself, when you're travelling in a straight line move the four fingers behind the wheel, it helps you to get rid of any tension. (don't touch you shift paddles like Mika did at Monza) Make sure you're always on the corner ahead, as soon you're on the exit of one corner, focus on the braking point of the next. Try to get into a 100% mental focus without loosing sight for other things (like back markers). Fourth point; get yourself a force feedback wheel, it gives you that split second earlier indication that something is going wrong. When I've done quite some practising I actually don't go off anymore since I have my FF wheel. The fifth point is especially for duelling, when you're heading over to Parabolica or the first corner at Kyalami next to somebody make sure your head is saying: I'm not going to make the same mistake as him by braking too late. Make sure your opponent sees you in his mirror. And give every indication of going to brake very late. You do this by moving out of mirror right before the braking zone, he'll be focussing on you and try to do some late braking. While you'll just take a very nice (a bit early) braking point, it works in real life and it works in GPL. I know some of my points aren't about the mental thing, but get those right otherwise you're mental state will never help.

>- if someone is behind my, I try to ignore... ...and then it turns out to be John Surtees (or at least his AI incarnation), who attempts to outbrake me into Parabolica from about three inches behind my gerabox casing, runs straight of me, and punts me off into the gravel :-( I have trouble with "the head thing too". In what's laughingly referred to as my real life I took up motorcycle racing this year, and regularly find that (contrary to what you might expect) my laptimes are consistently and significantly _faster_ when I'm riding in traffic than when I've got clear track ahead of me. The reason? I dunno. Maybe it's confidence ("He's riding an identical 'bike on identical tyres - If he can leave his braking till _there_ so can I..."), maybe it's motivation ("He's three feet closer to me coming into Druids this time than he was last time round. If I get my head down, and concentrate I can get close enough to have a go at taking the place..." ) or maybe it's just plain lack of concentration ("Mmmmm. Lovely flowers, isn't it a nice day, Mmmm pretty girl... Hey! wasn't that my braking marker for Park...!") -- JG

>What about total brain fade? Sometimes (usually late at night) I'll go >screaming into a 3rd gear corner at top speed in 6th because I have simply >forgotten where I was on the track. Doh. This can happen in real life too. A friend of mine (and fellow motorcycle racer) once went straight on at Cadwell parks Coppice corner (fast, uphill left hander - on my bike it's flat out or just the barest hint of a "confidence lift" but Sols bike has literally twice the power mine has, and there's _no_ way a SS600 can take this bend without a dab of brakes and a downchange...) and simply _forgot_ _to_ _brake_ resulting in a 100+++ MPH moto-cross experience, followed by a fairly gentle (fortunately there's _lots_ of runoff here...) encounter with a grassy bank. His only recollection of how the incident happened is suddenly arriving at the turn-in point 20 MPH faster than he should have done with the throttle still open and no idea why! -- JG

found this a while ago .... http://www.muller.net/karting/docs/articles/brain1.html

: I dunno. Maybe it's confidence ("He's riding an identical 'bike on identical : tyres - If he can leave his braking till _there_ so can I..."), maybe it's Ouch. This exact same thought process has had *** consequences for me trying to follow other riders (bicycle) down the 100kph mountain passes in the Swiss Alps. Without the same skill as the guy you are trying to hang with, you can get in way over your head. Not to say you're not skilled; I certainly wasn't though, and still have the scars... Stephen

>: I dunno. Maybe it's confidence ("He's riding an identical 'bike on identical >: tyres - If he can leave his braking till _there_ so can I..."), maybe it's >Ouch. This exact same thought process has had *** consequences for me >trying to follow other riders (bicycle) down the 100kph mountain passes in >the Swiss Alps. Without the same skill as the guy you are trying to hang >with, you can get in way over your head... Fortunately, I've been racing with the pretty well the same people on a regular basis, and I know who's at least more or less on the same planet as me, and who can defy physics on a regular basis. It would be a very bad (not to mention painful and expensive) idea to try to use the same braking points as the Defy Physics set :-) -- JG

This is INCREDIBLE stuff! Here's an excerpt (Copyright 1996 W. Warren Chamberlain III) : "You must master mental techniques before you can master the associated physical techniques. For example, you must use the mental technique of "reducing the sensation of speed" before you can free enough attention to use the physical technique of "driving the proper line." (It's unfortunate that most to the physical techniques taught in racing schools and books can not be used by the students because they have not first been taught the mental techniques.) " --David Cook

writes LOL. That one gets me all the time. I even know I'm asking for trouble as I think it. My other one though, when I'm in front is, "It's boring on my own. I wonder... if I drive a bit faster maybe I can catch some backmarkers and try a few overtaking manoeuvres on them. They can't be too far down the road." That one's a real pig because until you actually come across your first backmarker you just can't stop trying to go that little bit faster, lap after lap. Your monitor starts playing tricks with you as you try to look further and further down the track. "Think I saw one ahead, just taking that corner! Come on! Get the power down!!" I try to be philosophical about this when it all goes wrong - at least after I've calmed down that is. It's nice to win, but it's more fun to race. 8-) -- Peter Ives (AKA Ivington)

>>- if someone is behind my, I try to ignore... >...and then it turns out to be John Surtees (or at least his AI >incarnation), who attempts to outbrake me into Parabolica from about three >inches behind my gerabox casing, runs straight of me, and punts me off into >the gravel :-( Being a long time motorcyclist I've always thought highly of John Surtees, but he sure stinks as a GPL AI driver. Don Scurlock Vancouver,B.C.

I learned this lesson quickly the first time i stepped into a real race car with other people. I had been driving sims for a long time but only a year ago did i learn the true value of patience. I was driving a Mini-Sprint for a friend who was ill that week. I had driven the car before at the same track but only on shakedown runs. I got out there for my heat and lets just say I learned really quickly that patience is a real virtue. When I was out there myself i could drive a line and not worry about taking someone else out of the race. Thankfully i survived the heat and the insuing consi and feature (how I made it there still befuddles me). I finished 15th in the feature (out of 20) but learned really well how not to try to hard or to quickly to make a pass. Chris

I really like the idea of driving a track in your mind. I think most people will be surprised of how effective it is.

: Being a long time motorcyclist I've always thought highly of John : Surtees, but he sure stinks as a GPL AI driver. Heh - I know what you mean. On the other hand there's a couple of things which mark poor John out for trouble in GPL. 1) You can always recognise him - he's the loony in the white car. If you collide with a green car, you might not spot who it was - a white car and it's surtees. 2) The Honda seems to perform rather differently to the other GPL cars. Surtees is always incredibly slow off the line and seems to find different braking points. Perhaps this leads to his erratic performances? -- Richard G. Clegg Only the mind is waving Networks and Non-Linear Dynamics Group Dept. of Mathematics, Uni. of York www: http://manor.york.ac.uk/top.html

Good post, Buzz -- I think "the head thing" is what actually separates the Roberto Morenos from the Paul Traceys in real life. Both are great drivers, but guys like Tracey seem to give in to the adrenalin rush, which often results in broken hardware and unfinished races. What I do to overcome this (sometimes successfully, usually not) is to try to imagine that my own hide is on the line, and my own hardware is at risk. If you run the risk of damage or injury in real life, you're going to be a bit more wary near the limit, and a bit more focused overall. I drive this way online, too, and I've been playing DTR quite a bit lately, and it continually amazes me how some folks will bulldoze their way through to a fast lap with complete disregard for simulated life, limb, and hardware. In real life, bonehead moves like that mean you won't finish the race, and that's what I try to keep in mind, regardless of whether I'm racing offline or online. Interestingly, I did a one-day driving school in October for real, and during my first on-track session, I spent a lot of time reminding myself that the hardware WAS real, and that my own life was at risk, just to make sure I didn't laps into the sim racing "head thing" at the wrong moment. Once I got myself firmly-grounded, my second on-track session was MUCH smoother, and I gained ground faster than a lot of guys after that. -- JB Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

> I really like the idea of driving a track in your mind. I think most people will be surprised of how effective it is. Yeah but once I took a wrong turn in my mind and I was lost for weeks! dave henrie

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> : It's a head thing. You're in front and you decide to do the fastest lap > : of the race. Why?...Whyyyyy???? > : It's a head thing. > : Is there a patch for this? > Red glasses to filter out the red mist? I do this all the time, usually > after 40 minutes at Spa. I always overcook La Source trying to be a hero. > Dohh.

Funny that. I always overcook the Masta Kink, surely it's possible to take it flat? - Michael

> Funny that. I always overcook the Masta Kink, surely it's possible to > take it flat? I virtually never lift there, and when I'm lucky I can take it almost without any tire squeel at all. In the f3, that is :-)

> > Funny that. I always overcook the Masta Kink, surely it's possible to > > take it flat? > I virtually never lift there, and when I'm lucky I can take it > almost without any tire squeel at all. In the f3, that is :-) I'm confused on what corner this is. I always thought, by the way people have been talking about it, That "Masta" was the right hand corner that drops down very quickly. It looks like on the track map in GPL that that is really "Malmedy". Then the "Masta" kink is a left and then right shortly there after. With the F3, There is the Chacane at the bottom of the hill at the S/F. followed immediately by a right hand turn. Then there is a small strait and a left kink and then.. I softly touch the brake and downshift for Les Combes. The next time I slow down is for Malmedy (or what I think is Malmedy) by lifting and downshifting with out touching the brake. Stavelots I blip the gas up about 1/4 then back down all within a 1/4 second. The At The last hairpin, I'll down shift to second (or first on the first lap and cold tires). In any case.. Is the Masta kink the corner that drops out on you? or is it just that, relatively, flat left/right? Maybe I should drive the course with someone and have him say.. "we are now in the Melmedy turn", we are now in the Masta kink, we are now crossing the S/F line..." -- ========================================= Mike Barlow of Barlow Racing? ========================================= http://members.xoom.com/BarlowRacing/ Racing online with the help of...... Race Communications Association Holodyne Engineering Mystic Music (have Your !!Name/Address!! placed here)

> > I really like the idea of driving a track in your mind. I think most people will be surprised of how effective it is. I did the same thing, but since I'm small minded, I was only lost for a minute or two :)

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> > > Funny that. I always overcook the Masta Kink, surely it's possible to > > > take it flat? > > I virtually never lift there, and when I'm lucky I can take it > > almost without any tire squeel at all. In the f3, that is :-) > I'm confused on what corner this is. I always thought, by the way > people have been talking about it, That "Masta" was the right hand > corner that drops down very quickly. It looks like on the track map in > GPL that that is really "Malmedy". Then the "Masta" kink is a left and > then right shortly there after.

The track map is correct, so Masta is the left-right at the middle of the long straight. Hence the smiley.

[SNIP] Cool a GPL rally version :-). Too bad those cars don't have room for the co-driver. I can already image the co-driver at Rouen just before the hairpin saying : "Long right two, into left two, into *** white tyres..." // Johan

: Cool a GPL rally version :-). Too bad those cars don't have room for the : co-driver. : I can already image the co-driver at Rouen just before the hairpin : saying : "Long : right two, into left two, into *** white tyres..." (Grin) I'm glad it's not just me that habitually uses this line through the Rouen hairpin. -- Richard G. Clegg Only the mind is waving Networks and Non-Linear Dynamics Group Dept. of Mathematics, Uni. of York www: http://manor.york.ac.uk/

Perhaps we should have a poll om that? The top five of most missed corners in GPL :-) Here's mine starting with the most missed: 1 Spa - Just a tyre on the grass right after the masta kink and... WHAM! 2 Rouen - The 90 after the long straight. 3 Rouen - The hairpin. 4 Mexico - The hairpin again. I often slide out to just touch the guardrail. 5 'Ring - The part where you easely get airborn just before that right hand turn. I sometimes go off on the right, smoothly over fence without any damage. So there you are with your Ferrari in perfect condition and no place to get back on the track :-(. // Johan.

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> : Cool a GPL rally version :-). Too bad those cars don't have room for the > : co-driver. > : I can already image the co-driver at Rouen just before the hairpin > : saying : "Long > : right two, into left two, into *** white tyres..." > (Grin) I'm glad it's not just me that habitually uses this line > through the Rouen hairpin. > -- > Richard G. Clegg Only the mind is waving > Networks and Non-Linear Dynamics Group > Dept. of Mathematics, Uni. of York > www: [link lost in import]

For me that would be ALL corners of Brands Hatch. And sunday I have the IGPLC race there... back to practice now! Oh, and the second corner of Kyalami often causes me problems. I often turn in too late there. Typical. Andre On Wed, 01 Dec 1999 16:31:41 +0100, Johan Foederer

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>Perhaps we should have a poll om that? The top five of most missed >corners in GPL :-) >Here's mine starting with the most missed: >1 Spa - Just a tyre on the grass right after the masta kink and... WHAM! >2 Rouen - The 90 after the long straight. >3 Rouen - The hairpin. >4 Mexico - The hairpin again. I often slide out to just touch the >guardrail. >5 'Ring - The part where you easely get airborn just before that right >hand turn. I sometimes go off on the right, smoothly over fence without >any damage. So there you are with your Ferrari in perfect condition and >no place to get back on the track :-(. >// Johan. >> : Cool a GPL rally version :-). Too bad those cars don't have room for the >> : co-driver. >> : I can already image the co-driver at Rouen just before the hairpin >> : saying : "Long >> : right two, into left two, into *** white tyres..." >> (Grin) I'm glad it's not just me that habitually uses this line >> through the Rouen hairpin. >> -- >> Richard G. Clegg Only the mind is waving >> Networks and Non-Linear Dynamics Group >> Dept. of Mathematics, Uni. of York >> www: [link lost in import]

It's because we Honda drivers are special ;) (Who has different lines about everywhere compared to the normal GPL driver). -- -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... "People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

me too ... but different league: GGPLC ;-) this track is so damn slippery and I***up the 1st corner almost always ... *sigh* yep. and the sunset bend is also tricky at the entry ... Lio

"I let my mind wander, and it never came back" :-) -- Cheers! Graeme Nash

>Perhaps we should have a poll om that? The top five of most missed >corners in GPL :-) Mosport, the downhill left hander after the esses following S/F. Countless times. Kyalami, BBQ bend. I hate that corner. I hate all others, too, but those are the nastiest I can come up with ;-) Uwe -- Uwe Schuerkamp http://www.schuerkamp.de/ Herford, Germany (52.0N/8h30mE) Ever wondered what's wrong with the world? http://bnetwork.com/ PGP Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

The scary thing is, this does even make sense.... Remco

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>Accelerate >Third >Pinch the nose right >Accelerate >Forth >Bring the nose left >Drift right >Drift >Bring nose s l o w l y right >Fifth >Head to the left verge >Straightaway >Straight >Straight >Braking zone coming >Nuts, I'm outa cat food >Aaaaaaaaa >BRAKE >Locked! >Nonononoooo >Steer >Steer >Brake >Steer >Made it >Downshift >Downshift >Downshift >Go go go go >Look at shifter location >Downshift again >Damn cat >Shift >Straight >Third >Bear right >Forth >Start turn-in left >Fifth >Keep turn gentle >Save speed >Cat can starve >Braking area just >Here! >Downshift >Downshift >Tuck nose inside of line >Gas and Steer >Come straight >Hard gas >Forth >Turn left >Stay left of dip >Downshift >Brake >Downshift >Set alarm for five or five -fif***? >AH *** >not again... >Jeez >Am I ever gonna stop >Shift+R >Shift+R >Yeah yeah I know >I'm *trying* to stop! >Shift+R >Come on >Gawd finally >Accelerate >Second >Third >1:15.99! >Stupid game >Just one more lap

WG? Now do it for the 'Ring :-) Andrew McP

> WG? Now do it for the 'Ring :-) from memory..take your time, you have 9 minutes! dave henrie