Daytona - Why the Fuss?

Howdy, I've recently driven the new Daytona track in N3 and was wondering what everyone is in such a tizzy about. Sure, the real NASCAR Daytona track is known more as a "handling" track than Talladega, and requires more of the driver to do well, but that's far from the case with the N3 version of Daytona. It's simply flat-out-follow-the-guy-in-front-of- you just like Talladega is. Different only in name and scenery. I can appreciate the mysticism that accompanies the name, but it's really no different. Welcoming opinions, -Chris- Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

And... ? Daytona is to Talladega what TexasMotorSpeedway is to C***teMS. Same basic shape, still alot different if you have any clue of corner radius, straight lenghts, strategies of drafting, etc.. -- -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.WeRace.net -- People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

good point.

I agree, the track is ALOT like Tally. It seems a little more narrow than Tally and the S/F line is a where it is supposed to be but it seems an awful lot like Tally to me. Maybe they took a page out of Gary's book! Al Stiff "Chris Cavin" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:88h2jk$6cn$[email hidden]...

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> Howdy, > > I've recently driven the new Daytona track in N3 and was wondering what > everyone is in such a tizzy about. Sure, the real NASCAR Daytona track > is known more as a "handling" track than Talladega, and requires more > of the driver to do well, but that's far from the case with the N3 > version of Daytona. It's simply flat-out-follow-the-guy-in-front-of- > you just like Talladega is. Different only in name and scenery. I can > appreciate the mysticism that accompanies the name, but it's really no > different. > > Welcoming opinions, > > -Chris- > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy.

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> > I can > > appreciate the mysticism that accompanies the name, but > > it's really no different. > And... ? > Daytona is to Talladega what TexasMotorSpeedway is to > C***teMS. Same basic shape, still alot different if > you have any clue of corner radius, straight lenghts, > strategies of drafting, etc.. > -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>

OK. Point taken. It is differently shaped and, thus, not identical to Talladega. What I was getting at, though, was how in the Papy version of Daytona you don't drive it any differently than the Papy version of Talladega. It's 100%-foot-to-the-floor all the time. I was even dicing with the AI and changing lines on the banking without lifting. -Chris- Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

Agree'd.....Tally & Daytona can be a bore....which brings up another Q.... How's come every time I go to race online there's almost nuttin but talladega running? Most everything worthwhile is either password lockout or 300+ Ping..... (Don't use NO***in E-mail) You think in the storm we've found the eye of the calm.....Bill Mallonnee, Vigilantes Of Love

Opinion - they're both flat out restrictor plate tracks, which many drivers, real and simmed, hate. But Daytona is narrow and the straights are a lot shorter, very different "rhythm". Driving in traffic is very different because of the narrow width. Basically the tizzy is that it's a great thing for those of us who want to drive the track and then watch the actual race. Anybody tried it with Legends yet? bob

Tally races are for the newbies, I guess... I've never understood why Talladega is the most popular track. -- ----------------------------------- Morgan Vincent Wooten http://members.tripod.com/~morganv/ -----------------------------------

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> > I can > > appreciate the mysticism that accompanies the name, but it's really no > > different. > And... ? > Daytona is to Talladega what TexasMotorSpeedway is to C***teMS. Same > basic shape, still alot different if you have any clue of corner radius, > straight lenghts, strategies of drafting, etc..

So you have driven the N3 Daytona track and seen a difference in the required driving style??? It sounds like Dega with a Daytona paint job to me. -- Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes. cisko [AT] ix [DOT] netcom [DOT] com

Well OK... That is enough for me. I do believe the rhythm should be different. If it is as you say, that is good enough for me. -- Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes. cisko [AT] ix [DOT] netcom [DOT] com

And what's wrong with a 500 mile straight race. I Love Bristol and Homestead is my favorite but, that does not mean I don't like the thrill of going 200+ mph and passing some of the best of them. As far as 100% flat out racing, If you never lift at Daytona or Dega then you must be the guy who hits me when he is drafting at 200+ on the backstretch:). Obviously I am a #3 fan!! GO DALE

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> > Howdy, > > I've recently driven the new Daytona track in N3 and was wondering what > > everyone is in such a tizzy about. Sure, the real NASCAR Daytona track > > is known more as a "handling" track than Talladega, and requires more > > of the driver to do well, but that's far from the case with the N3 > > version of Daytona. It's simply flat-out-follow-the-guy-in-front-of- > > you just like Talladega is. Different only in name and scenery. I can > > appreciate the mysticism that accompanies the name, but it's really no > > different. > I don't get it either. It's just a flat-out drafting battle. The only > reason Talladega and Daytona have any curves at all is so they can fit > the racetrack in the plot of land. As far as the skill of driving a > vehicle round a turn goes, they may as well be a straight 500 mile > freeway. > - Michael

First you are comparing two tracks that are not replicating real life all that well. Both Dega and the Papytona have very relaxed tire wear and fairly high grip settings. Why? Think of the number of arcade racers (very broad definition here) that only race Dega online. It is simple marketing, and Im sure Papy has learned from the GPL "too difficult so Im returning it" sales. If you were to bring the tires setting to a more realistic stting, Papy-Tona does become more a handling track in which you have to pay attention to tire wear and possible even breath off the throttle hear and there. You think that would work for the masses? na, too many people would actually have to make a setup.... eeek! Second, Tona and Dega have some very big differences that an experienced sim racer or driver would easily recognize. 1) the back straight is shorter, 2) the tri-oval is longer, 3) the banking is less, 4) the track width is 8' less, 5) the turns have a shorter radius (1000' vs Degas 1100') These may not all seem like a lot, but they add up to make a very different track then Dega Third, If you know where to look you can see that the Daytona track was created wrong. it is 2.5 miles around where the apron meets the track, while Dega is 2.66 miles measured a lane from the outside wall. NASCAR measures thier tracks at either 10 or 11 feet from the outside wall, that is what determines if the track is 2.5 or 2.7 miles. Unfortunately, the Papytona is probably closer to 2.7 miles long because of this simple design flaw. You can test this theory by driving on the apron holding a speed of 60mph... it will take you 2.5 minutes to travel the track. Now do it at 10 feet from the outside wall, it will take you longer than 2.5 min. (60mph = 1 mile per minute) ----- Original Message ----- Newsgroups: rec.autos.simulators Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2000 7:03 AM Subject: Daytona - Why the Fuss?

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> Howdy, > I've recently driven the new Daytona track in N3 and was wondering what > everyone is in such a tizzy about. Sure, the real NASCAR Daytona track > is known more as a "handling" track than Talladega, and requires more > of the driver to do well, but that's far from the case with the N3 > version of Daytona. It's simply flat-out-follow-the-guy-in-front-of- > you just like Talladega is. Different only in name and scenery. I can > appreciate the mysticism that accompanies the name, but it's really no > different. > Welcoming opinions, > -Chris- > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. > Howdy, > I've recently driven the new Daytona track in N3 and was wondering what > everyone is in such a tizzy about. Sure, the real NASCAR Daytona track > is known more as a "handling" track than Talladega, and requires more > of the driver to do well, but that's far from the case with the N3 > version of Daytona. It's simply flat-out-follow-the-guy-in-front-of- > you just like Talladega is. Different only in name and scenery. I can > appreciate the mysticism that accompanies the name, but it's really no > different. > Welcoming opinions, > -Chris- > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy.

Then what the hell is the idiot that started this thread talking about? Also, I thought someone said the track wouldn't work online with won.net (which is the only way I have been doing online). -- Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes. cisko [AT] ix [DOT] netcom [DOT] com

FWIW, I don't find much of a difference between the 2 tracks. If indeed in real life you're required to lift through the turns, then the Daytona demo is way off since you're able to zip around the track flat out. Hmmm, sounds just like another track. I don't find much difference between C***te/Texas either. Sure there are banking diffs, etc., but they don't add up to a markedly different driving experience. The differences between Daytona/Dega are even less noticeable. On Sat, 19 Feb 2000 08:01:10 -0600, "Greg Cisko"

Who's the wimp here? You happen to like Tally most because you aren't able to find your braking points on other tracks and don't know where to accelerate, right? Have you ever tried gpl? If so did you ever finish a lap without spinning (and without full throttle fast fast fast railriding)? what's the deal about racing when all you have to do is go flat out? I understand you love Tally because you don't need a lot of practise or skill to be a (offline) race winner. one of the most fun aspects of racing sims is the cornering technique! Find your braking point, don't lock up, release the brake pedal, steer in and gently apply the throttle, don't spin the wheels when exiting. If you don't like that in a sim, go find you fun elsewhere and give NFS and other arcade racers a try: full throttle fun and easy! I'm sure you'll like that. Ever taken a plane? A Boeing 747 goes FAST FAST FAST too, much faster than a dragster! Does that give you a thrill? No, because you aren't cornering, braking, accelerating... F1's most boring track is Hockenheim. It's one of the fastest tracks in F1, but drivers complain that it has to much long straights. It ain't a drivers track. All you need is a fast car with the most topspeed. You don't need to be the best driver to win there. My point: everybody can accelerate and go fast! You don't need to be skilled for that. Every wimp can do that. Scotty <[email hidden]> schreef in berichtnieuws [email hidden]... > Morgan VW� wrote: > > > > Tally races are for the newbies, I guess... I've never understood whyTalladega

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> > is the most popular track. > > > > I happen to like Dega the best... Racing is NOT "hitting the Brakes" > and "Slowing down", screw that, RACING is going FAST FAST FAST, using > your skills to hit the corners just right, conserve your tires, draft... > Braking is for p*$$ies who are scared to go fast ..... Thats just my > opinion ... Same for Drag Racing, you don't hit the brakes till the race > is over.. You see some of us like the thrill of extream speed... I do > in a sim as well as real life (I've gone 155-160 mph) ... we all have > our things. > > scott

And what if the others that had joined your session do not have the new daytona, or have the deg-tona renamed track? -- Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes. cisko [AT] ix [DOT] netcom [DOT] com

On Sun, 20 Feb 2000 02:54:45 -0500, The Black Cat =^..^= <[email hidden]> wrote: >Ah, Scotty, I see you're jabbing people in the ribs again, Again? When was the last time? :)

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>but I >remember well that you and I were the two best road racers back in the >old league, so I know for a fact that you can turn right as well as >left... > >Let's just say that in the past week or so, practicing for Dega races >for several leagues, I've learned to appreciate the skills necessary >for that track. And, in a crowd, it's a lot of fun. But if you get >spit out the back or if you come out of the pits to an empty track, >it's one of the most BOOOOOOOOORRRRRRRING places around.

I appreciate it as well in a tight pack. I just couldn't resist digging in with that post. :) > >Given my druthers, I'll still take a road course, but for constant >action, the ovals are equally as entertaining...

GPL is not perfect, they don't tire wear. So a lot of times I would come down a hairpin at full speed and just lock them up purposely, just so I can get the car to be more stable. And sometimes you can get better braking distance from it (depends on the situation) In article <Bu6sfH$e$GA.354@btbntsys4>, "Tim Vanhee" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Who's the wimp here? >You happen to like Tally most because you aren't able to find your braking >points on other tracks and don't know where to accelerate, right? Have you >ever tried gpl? If so did you ever finish a lap without spinning (and >without full throttle fast fast fast railriding)? >what's the deal about racing when all you have to do is go flat out? I >understand you love Tally because you don't need a lot of practise or skill >to be a (offline) race winner. >one of the most fun aspects of racing sims is the cornering technique! Find >your braking point, don't lock up, release the brake pedal, steer in and >gently apply the throttle, don't spin the wheels when exiting. >If you don't like that in a sim, go find you fun elsewhere and give NFS and >other arcade racers a try: full throttle fun and easy! I'm sure you'll like >that. >Ever taken a plane? A Boeing 747 goes FAST FAST FAST too, much faster than

a

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>dragster! Does that give you a thrill? No, because you aren't cornering, >braking, accelerating... >F1's most boring track is Hockenheim. It's one of the fastest tracks in F1, >but drivers complain that it has to much long straights. It ain't a drivers >track. All you need is a fast car with the most topspeed. You don't need to >be the best driver to win there. > >My point: everybody can accelerate and go fast! You don't need to be

skilled

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>for that. Every wimp can do that. > > >Scotty <[email hidden]> schreef in berichtnieuws >[email hidden]... >> Morgan VW� wrote: >> > >> > Tally races are for the newbies, I guess... I've never understood why >Talladega >> > is the most popular track. >> > >> >> I happen to like Dega the best... Racing is NOT "hitting the Brakes" >> and "Slowing down", screw that, RACING is going FAST FAST FAST, using >> your skills to hit the corners just right, conserve your tires, draft... >> Braking is for p*$$ies who are scared to go fast ..... Thats just my >> opinion ... Same for Drag Racing, you don't hit the brakes till the race >> is over.. You see some of us like the thrill of extream speed... I do >> in a sim as well as real life (I've gone 155-160 mph) ... we all have >> our things. >> >> scott > >

You know, I don't put much attention to Nascar and the oval racing business. No offense meant there; it's just not my bag. I *personally* find other types of racing more interesting. But I remember when Senna was killed how stations and newspapers interviewed drivers all across the racing spectrum, and they all showed that they realized it was a profound loss, and all showed great respect across the racing profession--from Nascar, to Indy, to NHRA, to whatever. That made an impression on me--I think I matured a bit as a fan. And I remember also, that when ESPN used to do those "Ask the Driver" bits, which were often silly--I remember being absolutely thrilled to know that Ricardo Patrese likes spaghetti a lot--for their F1 coverage, that many F1 drivers (Derek Warwick, for example) said that they liked to watch Nascar. Warwick said he was a "bit of a fan of that Dale Earnhardt--he seems like a tough character." I wonder if there's any room in this thread to simply state that controlling a racing vehicle at it's limits (whether Nascar OR F1) demands a LOT of skill. I don't think there's a whole lot of room for "pussies" in either series, despite the occasional "pay-to-drive" debacle. Just a thought, David K. "Tim Vanhee" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Bu6sfH$e$GA.354@btbntsys4...

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> Who's the wimp here? > You happen to like Tally most because you aren't able to find your braking > points on other tracks and don't know where to accelerate, right? Have you > ever tried gpl? If so did you ever finish a lap without spinning (and > without full throttle fast fast fast railriding)? > what's the deal about racing when all you have to do is go flat out? I > understand you love Tally because you don't need a lot of practise or

skill > to be a (offline) race winner. > one of the most fun aspects of racing sims is the cornering technique!Find > your braking point, don't lock up, release the brake pedal, steer in and > gently apply the throttle, don't spin the wheels when exiting. > If you don't like that in a sim, go find you fun elsewhere and give NFSand > other arcade racers a try: full throttle fun and easy! I'm sure you'lllike > that. > Ever taken a plane? A Boeing 747 goes FAST FAST FAST too, much faster thana > dragster! Does that give you a thrill? No, because you aren't cornering, > braking, accelerating... > F1's most boring track is Hockenheim. It's one of the fastest tracks inF1, > but drivers complain that it has to much long straights. It ain't adrivers > track. All you need is a fast car with the most topspeed. You don't needto > be the best driver to win there. > > My point: everybody can accelerate and go fast! You don't need to beskilled

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> for that. Every wimp can do that. > > > Scotty <[email hidden]> schreef in berichtnieuws > [email hidden]... > > Morgan VW� wrote: > > > > > > Tally races are for the newbies, I guess... I've never understood why > Talladega > > > is the most popular track. > > > > > > > I happen to like Dega the best... Racing is NOT "hitting the Brakes" > > and "Slowing down", screw that, RACING is going FAST FAST FAST, using > > your skills to hit the corners just right, conserve your tires, draft... > > Braking is for p*$$ies who are scared to go fast ..... Thats just my > > opinion ... Same for Drag Racing, you don't hit the brakes till the race > > is over.. You see some of us like the thrill of extream speed... I do > > in a sim as well as real life (I've gone 155-160 mph) ... we all have > > our things. > > > > scott > >

"David Karr" <[email hidden]> wrote > I wonder if there's any room in this thread to simply state thatcontrolling > a racing vehicle at it's limits (whether Nascar OR F1) demands a LOT of > skill. Sure David. You wouldn't be surprised but the majority of race fans have an equal opinion of any kind of motorsport. They might not "get it" fully, but I hope that most of the people understand that winning a WinstonCup race is not easy, and doesn't simply mean turning right. Same goes for Nascar fans who I hope think that Formula 1 isn't an easy task. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.WeRace.net -- People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

Imagine a sim that modeled not only wear, but flat-spotting as well . . . (the Force-Feedback would be really great, there) --DK "Cossie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:88q6ie$u83$[email hidden]... > GPL is not perfect, they don't tire wear. So a lot of times I would come > down a hairpin at full speed and just lock them up purposely, just so Ican

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> get the car to be more stable. And sometimes you can get better braking > distance from it (depends on the situation) > > In article <Bu6sfH$e$GA.354@btbntsys4>, > "Tim Vanhee" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >Who's the wimp here? > >You happen to like Tally most because you aren't able to find your

braking > >points on other tracks and don't know where to accelerate, right? Haveyou > >ever tried gpl? If so did you ever finish a lap without spinning (and > >without full throttle fast fast fast railriding)? > >what's the deal about racing when all you have to do is go flat out? I > >understand you love Tally because you don't need a lot of practise orskill > >to be a (offline) race winner. > >one of the most fun aspects of racing sims is the cornering technique!Find > >your braking point, don't lock up, release the brake pedal, steer in and > >gently apply the throttle, don't spin the wheels when exiting. > >If you don't like that in a sim, go find you fun elsewhere and give NFSand > >other arcade racers a try: full throttle fun and easy! I'm sure you'lllike > >that. > >Ever taken a plane? A Boeing 747 goes FAST FAST FAST too, much fasterthan > a > >dragster! Does that give you a thrill? No, because you aren't cornering, > >braking, accelerating... > >F1's most boring track is Hockenheim. It's one of the fastest tracks inF1, > >but drivers complain that it has to much long straights. It ain't adrivers > >track. All you need is a fast car with the most topspeed. You don't needto

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> >be the best driver to win there. > > > >My point: everybody can accelerate and go fast! You don't need to be > skilled > >for that. Every wimp can do that. > > > > > >Scotty <[email hidden]> schreef in berichtnieuws > >[email hidden]... > >> Morgan VW� wrote: > >> > > >> > Tally races are for the newbies, I guess... I've never understood why > >Talladega > >> > is the most popular track. > >> > > >> > >> I happen to like Dega the best... Racing is NOT "hitting the Brakes" > >> and "Slowing down", screw that, RACING is going FAST FAST FAST, using > >> your skills to hit the corners just right, conserve your tires,

draft... > >> Braking is for p*$$ies who are scared to go fast ..... Thats just my > >> opinion ... Same for Drag Racing, you don't hit the brakes till therace

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> >> is over.. You see some of us like the thrill of extream speed... I do > >> in a sim as well as real life (I've gone 155-160 mph) ... we all have > >> our things. > >> > >> scott > > > > > >

Playing with the draft in a race can be fun for a while, but that's really the only thing that makes Daytona/Tally races any fun. If you lose the draft or manage to pull ahead though, it's nap-time. Forget about it... -- ----------------------------------- Morgan Vincent Wooten mailto:[email hidden] http://members.tripod.com/~morganv/ ----------------------------------- Scotty <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Morgan VW� wrote: > > > > Tally races are for the newbies, I guess... I've never understood why Talladega > > is the most popular track. > > > > I happen to like Dega the best... Racing is NOT "hitting the Brakes" > and "Slowing down", screw that, RACING is going FAST FAST FAST, using > your skills to hit the corners just right, conserve your tires, draft... > Braking is for p*$$ies who are scared to go fast ..... Thats just my > opinion ... Same for Drag Racing, you don't hit the brakes till the race > is over.. You see some of us like the thrill of extream speed... I do > in a sim as well as real life (I've gone 155-160 mph) ... we all have > our things. > > scott >

>GPL is not perfect, they don't tire wear. So a lot of times I would come >down a hairpin at full speed and just lock them up purposely, just so I can >get the car to be more stable. And sometimes you can get better braking >distance from it (depends on the situation) The reason GPL doesn't model tyre wear is because the tyres they used back then were so hard that they would last several races before being changed. They also were very difficult to flat spot, again because they were so hard. They will, however, get VERY hot, which raises the pressure and makes the car very skaty and hard to control. Actually very realistic. Rafe Mc

> Talladega. What I was getting at, though, was how in the Papy version > of Daytona you don't drive it any differently than the Papy version of > Talladega. It's 100%-foot-to-the-floor all the time. I was even > dicing with the AI and changing lines on the banking without lifting. Which is exactly like the real thing. Mark Martin was heard over his radio yesterday saying that he hadn't lifted in over 30 laps. <remove 7of9 for e-mail replies> -- Bill Jones e-mail addresses: (860) 701-1201 WWW: http://pages.cthome.net/billj

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> > > "Greg Cisko" <no.spam.email.for.me> wrote > > > So you have driven the N3 Daytona track and seen a difference > > > in the required driving style??? It sounds like Dega with a > > > Daytona paint job to me. > > Err... absolutely. As big as finding the different between Texas > > Motor Speedway and C***te per example. Change weight a little, > > camber a little, change the shocks sometimes, put the gear down. > > Greg you've ever raced the track online? If you "dega-it", you > > will wreck. There is subtile difference that experienced drivers > > will find the minute they lap the track, like the tri-oval camber > > elevation change after the S/F line, how the track banking elevates > > itself, how tight the corner radius is and how it affects downforce. > Then what the hell is the idiot that started this thread talking about? > Also, I thought someone said the track wouldn't work online with > won.net (which is the only way I have been doing online).

I'm the idiot who started this thread. :) I wasn't ever trying to imply that the two Papy tracks were identical. I was simply pointing out that there wasn't any difference, for me, in how I had to drive Daytona vs. the way I have to drive Talladega. I'm sure in real life that Daytona is hard to drive. It's just not any harder to drive than Talladega (which is darned easy IMHO) in N3. -Chris-

Very Very well said:) > First you are comparing two tracks that are not replicating real life all > that well. Both Dega and the Papytona have very relaxed tire wear and fairly > high grip settings. Why? Think of the number of arcade racers (very broad > definition here) that only race Dega online. It is simple marketing, and Im > sure Papy has learned from the GPL "too difficult so Im returning it" sales. > If you were to bring the tires setting to a more realistic stting, Papy-Tona > does become more a handling track in which you have to pay attention to tire > wear and possible even breath off the throttle hear and there. You think > that would work for the masses? na, too many people would actually have to > make a setup.... eeek! > Second, Tona and Dega have some very big differences that an experienced sim > racer or driver would easily recognize. 1) the back straight is shorter, 2) > the tri-oval is longer, 3) the banking is less, 4) the track width is 8' > less, 5) the turns have a shorter radius (1000' vs Degas 1100') These may > not all seem like a lot, but they add up to make a very different track then > Dega > Third, If you know where to look you can see that the Daytona track was > created wrong. it is 2.5 miles around where the apron meets the track, while > Dega is 2.66 miles measured a lane from the outside wall. NASCAR measures > thier tracks at either 10 or 11 feet from the outside wall, that is what > determines if the track is 2.5 or 2.7 miles. Unfortunately, the Papytona is > probably closer to 2.7 miles long because of this simple design flaw. You > can test this theory by driving on the apron holding a speed of 60mph... it > will take you 2.5 minutes to travel the track. Now do it at 10 feet from the

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> outside wall, it will take you longer than 2.5 min. (60mph = 1 mile per > minute) > ----- Original Message ----- > Newsgroups: rec.autos.simulators > Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2000 7:03 AM > Subject: Daytona - Why the Fuss? > > Howdy, > > I've recently driven the new Daytona track in N3 and was wondering what > > everyone is in such a tizzy about. Sure, the real NASCAR Daytona track > > is known more as a "handling" track than Talladega, and requires more > > of the driver to do well, but that's far from the case with the N3 > > version of Daytona. It's simply flat-out-follow-the-guy-in-front-of- > > you just like Talladega is. Different only in name and scenery. I can > > appreciate the mysticism that accompanies the name, but it's really no > > different. > > Welcoming opinions, > > -Chris- > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. > > Howdy, > > I've recently driven the new Daytona track in N3 and was wondering what > > everyone is in such a tizzy about. Sure, the real NASCAR Daytona track > > is known more as a "handling" track than Talladega, and requires more > > of the driver to do well, but that's far from the case with the N3 > > version of Daytona. It's simply flat-out-follow-the-guy-in-front-of- > > you just like Talladega is. Different only in name and scenery. I can > > appreciate the mysticism that accompanies the name, but it's really no > > different. > > Welcoming opinions, > > -Chris- > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy.

I didn't say it was easy to win the Winston cup. I am talking about sims here. And I know how hard it is to win a online race at Tally. All I'm trying to say is that it is harder to get in a car and going fast at a road course than it is on an oval. Take for example N3. Take 10 rookies and 10 aces and put them together in a race. The rookies will be much closer to the aces on Tally than they will be at Sears Point. I certainly do have a lot of respect for Nascar racers! I know Nascar isn't easy! > You know, I don't put much attention to Nascar and the oval racing business. > No offense meant there; it's just not my bag. I *personally* find other > types of racing more interesting. But I remember when Senna was killed how > stations and newspapers interviewed drivers all across the racing spectrum, > and they all showed that they realized it was a profound loss, and all > showed great respect across the racing profession--from Nascar, to Indy, to

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> NHRA, to whatever. That made an impression on me--I think I matured a bit > as a fan. And I remember also, that when ESPN used to do those "Ask the > Driver" bits, which were often silly--I remember being absolutely thrilled > to know that Ricardo Patrese likes spaghetti a lot--for their F1 coverage, > that many F1 drivers (Derek Warwick, for example) said that they liked to > watch Nascar. Warwick said he was a "bit of a fan of that Dale > Earnhardt--he seems like a tough character." > I wonder if there's any room in this thread to simply state that

controlling

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> a racing vehicle at it's limits (whether Nascar OR F1) demands a LOT of > skill. I don't think there's a whole lot of room for "pussies" in either > series, despite the occasional "pay-to-drive" debacle. > Just a thought, > David K. > > Who's the wimp here? > > You happen to like Tally most because you aren't able to find your

braking > > points on other tracks and don't know where to accelerate, right? Have you

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> > ever tried gpl? If so did you ever finish a lap without spinning (and > > without full throttle fast fast fast railriding)? > > what's the deal about racing when all you have to do is go flat out? I > > understand you love Tally because you don't need a lot of practise or > skill > > to be a (offline) race winner. > > one of the most fun aspects of racing sims is the cornering technique! > Find > > your braking point, don't lock up, release the brake pedal, steer in and > > gently apply the throttle, don't spin the wheels when exiting. > > If you don't like that in a sim, go find you fun elsewhere and give NFS > and > > other arcade racers a try: full throttle fun and easy! I'm sure you'll > like > > that. > > Ever taken a plane? A Boeing 747 goes FAST FAST FAST too, much faster

than

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> a > > dragster! Does that give you a thrill? No, because you aren't cornering, > > braking, accelerating... > > F1's most boring track is Hockenheim. It's one of the fastest tracks in > F1, > > but drivers complain that it has to much long straights. It ain't a > drivers > > track. All you need is a fast car with the most topspeed. You don't need > to > > be the best driver to win there. > > My point: everybody can accelerate and go fast! You don't need to be > skilled > > for that. Every wimp can do that. > > > > Tally races are for the newbies, I guess... I've never understood

why > > Talladega > > > > is the most popular track. > > > I happen to like Dega the best... Racing is NOT "hitting the Brakes" > > > and "Slowing down",***that, RACING is going FAST FAST FAST, using > > > your skills to hit the corners just right, conserve your tires, draft... > > > Braking is for p*$$ies who are scared to go fast ..... Thats just my > > > opinion ... Same for Drag Racing, you don't hit the brakes till the race > > > is over.. You see some of us like the thrill of extream speed... I do > > > in a sim as well as real life (I've gone 155-160 mph) ... we all have > > > our things. > > > scott

Well IMHO after trying the track online (on won.net) and offline I can say that you are 100% wrong in all of your assessments of Daytona. The rythm is much different than Dega, Mark Martin mentioned to his crew that he went 30+ laps without lifting, yada yada yada :-) -- Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes. cisko [AT] ix [DOT] netcom [DOT] com

I seem to have more trouble coming off the 4th turn at Daytona two wide. Tend to wag the rear end and bounce off the wall on occasion. Haven't gotten the nerve to try 3 wide yet :) Jim > > > Then what the hell is the idiot that started this thread talking about?

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> > > Also, I thought someone said the track wouldn't work online with > > > won.net (which is the only way I have been doing online). > > I'm the idiot who started this thread. :) > Well IMHO after trying the track online (on won.net) and offline > I can say that you are 100% wrong in all of your assessments of > Daytona. The rythm is much different than Dega, Mark Martin > mentioned to his crew that he went 30+ laps without lifting, > yada yada yada :-) > -- > Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming

hordes. > cisko [AT] ix [DOT] netcom [DOT] com > > I wasn't ever trying to imply that the two Papy tracks were identical. > > I was simply pointing out that there wasn't any difference, for me, in > > how I had to drive Daytona vs. the way I have to drive Talladega. > > I'm sure in real life that Daytona is hard to drive. It's just not any > > harder to drive than Talladega (which is darned easy IMHO) in N3. > > -Chris-

From his attitude so far, he probably used a wall <G> -- Ian Parker UKGPL League http://members.xoom.com/ukgpl == > Tell me, oh Brave One, just how did you, ummm, SLOW DOWN after reaching your > stated 155-160 mph? > -- > Regards, > Bruce Kennewell, > Canberra, Australia. > --------------------------- > > > Tally races are for the newbies, I guess... I've never understood why > Talladega > > > is the most popular track. > > I happen to like Dega the best... Racing is NOT "hitting the Brakes" > > and "Slowing down",***that, RACING is going FAST FAST FAST, using > > your skills to hit the corners just right, conserve your tires, draft... > > Braking is for p*$$ies who are scared to go fast ..... Thats just my > > opinion ... Same for Drag Racing, you don't hit the brakes till the race > > is over.. You see some of us like the thrill of extream speed... I do > > in a sim as well as real life (I've gone 155-160 mph) ... we all have > > our things. > > scott > -----------== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ==---------- > http://www.newsfeeds.com The Largest Usenet Servers in the World! > ------== Over 73,000 Newsgroups - Including Dedicated Binaries Servers ==-----

> I seem to have more trouble coming off the 4th turn at Daytona two > wide. Tend to wag the rear end and bounce off the wall on occasion. > Haven't gotten the nerve to try 3 wide yet :) Exactly right. I had none of those problems at Dega :-) -- Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes. cisko [AT] ix [DOT] netcom [DOT] com

I noticed that also.. I think the online popularity of a track has to do with the real schedule of WC. This week you should probably see more short tracks, but Tally is popular simply becuase its easy to run. Ex

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>Agree'd.....Tally & Daytona can be a bore....which brings up another Q.... >How's come every time I go to race online there's almost nuttin but talladega >running? Most everything worthwhile is either password lockout or 300+ >Ping..... >(Don't use NO***in E-mail) >You think in the storm we've found the eye of the calm.....Bill Mallonnee, >Vigilantes Of Love

Guess I'll throw out my two cents. I agree with ya Chris on alot of what you said. I know when I got my copy of it I was a bit letdown. To get right down to it, nothing more than a glorious Talladega conversion. Same dega pit and pit wall. Daytona has stright pit lane and no wall. But overlooking those obvious "flaws", hehe, the track looks different "enough" to keep me from thinking "why am I not just racing Dega instead?". The curves seem a bit smoother is about it, but I do see that the track is alot narrower than Dega. Which in a way, poses a small challenge only when going through the trioval, or dogleg on the track, seems to be narrowest there and 3 wide across start/finish line is sometimes trouble or heightened *** pressure, hehe. I'd say it's more of a thrilling track to run on than Dega, since it is narrower, basically the walls moved in. Also, the green grass patch between pit lane and track is nowhere near being proportional to the real life track. Try to spin the car around and make the number 3 in the grass like Dale did when he won, you'd take out a few parked cars in pit lane before you finish the 3, hehe. Seriously, i was fool enough to try it, couldn't stay on the grass. LOL Anyways, a couple good friends of mine who know the track in real life quite well, one of which raced there a few times with ARCA back in the late 80's/early 90's time period, and a wreck finished her career there, hehe (she's fine, car isn't tho), but they pointed out there doesn't seem to be the bump coming out of Turn 4 like the real life track has. Which is why they called it the fabled "calamity corner" cause of all the wrecks there that would gather up half the field sometimes in one big mess. If i'm not mistaken, the guy that wrecked in Sundays race right there at the end and caused it to finish under yellow, if you look at where he wrecked, was scraping along the wall going into the front stretch. Makes me wonder if ms. calamity corner snuck up and bit him, seeing as how he wrecked that car all by himself, hehe. Basically, not much different than Dega, slightly slower speeds seems to keep the cars packed in bunches for those that love door handle to door handle racing where you can reach over and hand your teammate a tylenol for those long days at the track, hehe. In some ways, I could do without Daytona in a race sim altogether. But I also realize how some are, about wanting their nascar sim experience to be a "complete" one with all the tracks and goodies. I'm a collector of things myself, so I can relate to that sentiment. But it's the "nose-turned-up" arrogance and attitudes displayed by ISC/DIS that turns me off to even wanting Daytona in any of my Nascar sims. Seems they'll do anything in their power to weezle and squeeze every last penny out of anyone willing to part with their money. (Fools and money soon part? Make any sense?) And you know, they got that old farm saying going on, "Milk that cash cow for all she's worth". Makes me wonder, ISC owns Talladega also. So what's the happs man. They fess up Dega, but not Tona? I got an idea, let's boycott Daytona in real life and in sims. Put the screws to them and see how they like it on the recieving end. ;o) Destin

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> > > I can > > > appreciate the mysticism that accompanies the name, but > > > it's really no different. > > And... ? > > Daytona is to Talladega what TexasMotorSpeedway is to > > C***teMS. Same basic shape, still alot different if > > you have any clue of corner radius, straight lenghts, > > strategies of drafting, etc.. > > -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard> > OK. Point taken. It is differently shaped and, thus, not identical to > Talladega. What I was getting at, though, was how in the Papy version > of Daytona you don't drive it any differently than the Papy version of > Talladega. It's 100%-foot-to-the-floor all the time. I was even > dicing with the AI and changing lines on the banking without lifting. > -Chris- > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy.

I'd like to comment, hehe. I enjoy all forms and variations of racing, for the most part. Probably the biggest factor in any form of racing, in my opinion only, is consistency. No matter if you're burning up the asphalt at Dega/Daytona type track, or carving the curves at Silverstone, losing your stomach through the corkscrew at Laguna Seca, whatever track, whatever layout or shape, if you're not consistent, you're not gonna do so well alot of times. Let's say you are protecting a 2 second lead, wether it's turn 1 in an oval, or turn 9 in a road course, if you mess up just once and not hit your line through the curve, you could lose precious speed, lost precious time, or worse, have to actually slow up more than you want in order to keep things in control. Nightmare would be rubbing the wall or spinning off in the grass. That one time you make the mistake, no matter how insignificant it may seem, nor how huge a mistake it is, they both can lose a race for you. I was born and raised practically in the shadow of a former Nascar track which is now closed and the "trailer park mafia" in the fields near it refuse to let it be opened, argh, anyways, I grew up around the oval racing scene. Naturally I'm a fan of it too. But at the same time, with the help of these racing sims, I can experience what Schumacher must be experiencing when he's blazing laps around Fiorano, Imola, Monza, Monaco, etc in his shiny red Ferrari. Sure, when I first started F1 sim racing, I sucked and stank. But thankfully, most all of the racers never put me down for it. It's not like the Quake2 mentality I got burned out on, can only hear "you suck" so many times before you gotta hit the OFF button, lol. I sometimes run into the same thing on Dega speed contests. Anyways, after putting in lots of practice, I can at least put up respectable times at F1 tracks in some of the racing sims I got. That in itself is an exhiliration very much like burning up Dega and putting up a 200mph+ qualify time. Just driving proper, being consistent, that "gets me off" for lack of a better phrase, and something a little more common used, LOL. In F1 sims, I can hit dega style speeds on some of the straights, the biggest challenge and adrenaline rush comes when it's time to apply the brakes and keep it on the track through a turn or a chicane. Just holding it steady and taking a good line, what a rush, lol, and then me with the grin and saying in my head "Damn, I kept it on the track! I didn't spin out, I didn't hit no walls. I survived!! Yahooo! I wanna do it again!!", lol. Not knocking any form of racing. They each have their merits and skills. I realize it. But simply going fast isn't gonna win anyone a race, well, maybe in drag racing, but even then, a bad reaction time off the launch and you might as well had never launched at all, race over. And neither will braking win races. Granted, in online racing, I've won races on road course simply by being a "survivor". I drove within my limits and used patience, tried to be consistent, dodged the odd wrecks in my path. Next thing ya know, I'm in first place simply cause I wasn't too impatient or too foolish. Granted, sometimes I get bit by that bug no matter what track it is. Just the other day it bit me on Dega, got brave while drafting the big dogs in the lead pack, and me being a tad overconfident in my ability to run it down to the white line perfectly, well, even perfection backfires, lol, i run a beautifully low on the line, pass 2 of the cars, speed bled off just enough that when i exited, hmmm. I'm hung out to dry. I just knew I could get them on the low line. Doh. No chance. And nobody was compassionate enough to move over and let me in the train, lol. I fell back and 2 laps later they are just dots on the horizon. I got one last thing to say and it really bugs me about Dega. The "you can't draft me" mentality, ROFL. I see it alot now. Someone gets in the lead on the very first lap and when they reach the back stretch, they weave left and right from infield to the wall, back and forth, weave enough to make 40 baskets in the backstretch alone. Not only is that annoying as hell, but not very realistic driving. Downright dangerous driving if you ask me. You can just imagine the ensuing donnybrook in the pits after the race, or more likely, after the big wreck, when Dale, Lil E, Tony the Tiger, etc are pounding away on this "Weaver". If i see it on the first lap, I either just fall back and wait for the wrecks, or just disconnect from the server and look for more skilled racers. I guess some have the "win at all costs" thinking, trying to keep you out of the draft, weaving all over, can't get around them. I can understand if it was the home stretch of the last lap, anything goes for sure, no problem there, but on the first straight on the first lap with 20, or more, to go?? That's dumb, very dumb, lol. No skill there, just dumbness, and lucky if they don't gather up and eliminate the entire field on the first lap in an ESPY winning wreck. Anyways.... Destin > > Tally races are for the newbies, I guess... I've never understood why Talladega

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> > is the most popular track. > I happen to like Dega the best... Racing is NOT "hitting the Brakes" > and "Slowing down",***that, RACING is going FAST FAST FAST, using > your skills to hit the corners just right, conserve your tires, draft... > Braking is for p*$$ies who are scared to go fast ..... Thats just my > opinion ... Same for Drag Racing, you don't hit the brakes till the race > is over.. You see some of us like the thrill of extream speed... I do > in a sim as well as real life (I've gone 155-160 mph) ... we all have > our things. > scott

LOL!! -- Regards, Bruce Kennewell, Canberra, Australia. --------------------------- > From his attitude so far, he probably used a wall <G> > -- > Ian Parker > UKGPL League http://members.xoom.com/ukgpl > == > > Tell me, oh Brave One, just how did you, ummm, SLOW DOWN after reaching > your > > stated 155-160 mph? > > -- > > Regards, > > Bruce Kennewell, > > Canberra, Australia. > > --------------------------- > > > > Tally races are for the newbies, I guess... I've never understood why > > Talladega > > > > is the most popular track. > > > I happen to like Dega the best... Racing is NOT "hitting the Brakes" > > > and "Slowing down",***that, RACING is going FAST FAST FAST, using > > > your skills to hit the corners just right, conserve your tires, draft... > > > Braking is for p*$$ies who are scared to go fast ..... Thats just my > > > opinion ... Same for Drag Racing, you don't hit the brakes till the race > > > is over.. You see some of us like the thrill of extream speed... I do > > > in a sim as well as real life (I've gone 155-160 mph) ... we all have > > > our things. > > > scott > > -----------== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News > ==---------- > > http://www.newsfeeds.com The Largest Usenet Servers in the World! > > ------== Over 73,000 Newsgroups - Including Dedicated Binaries Servers > ==----- -----------== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ==---------- http://www.newsfeeds.com The Largest Usenet Servers in the World! ------== Over 73,000 Newsgroups - Including Dedicated Binaries Servers ==-----

Okay, my message was aimed more at where the thread seemed to be heading, and in no way was aimed at you specifically. No offense meant. --DK > I didn't say it was easy to win the Winston cup. > I am talking about sims here. And I know how hard it is to win a online race > at Tally. > All I'm trying to say is that it is harder to get in a car and going fast at > a road course than it is on an oval. Take for example N3. Take 10 rookies > and 10 aces and put them together in a race. The rookies will be much closer > to the aces on Tally than they will be at Sears Point. > I certainly do have a lot of respect for Nascar racers! I know Nascar isn't

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> easy! > > You know, I don't put much attention to Nascar and the oval racing > business. > > No offense meant there; it's just not my bag. I *personally* find other > > types of racing more interesting. But I remember when Senna was killed > how > > stations and newspapers interviewed drivers all across the racing > spectrum, > > and they all showed that they realized it was a profound loss, and all > > showed great respect across the racing profession--from Nascar, to Indy, > to > > NHRA, to whatever. That made an impression on me--I think I matured a

bit > > as a fan. And I remember also, that when ESPN used to do those "Ask the > > Driver" bits, which were often silly--I remember being absolutely thrilled > > to know that Ricardo Patrese likes spaghetti a lot--for their F1 coverage, > > that many F1 drivers (Derek Warwick, for example) said that they liked to

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> > watch Nascar. Warwick said he was a "bit of a fan of that Dale > > Earnhardt--he seems like a tough character." > > I wonder if there's any room in this thread to simply state that > controlling > > a racing vehicle at it's limits (whether Nascar OR F1) demands a LOT of > > skill. I don't think there's a whole lot of room for "pussies" in

either

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> > series, despite the occasional "pay-to-drive" debacle. > > Just a thought, > > David K. > > > Who's the wimp here? > > > You happen to like Tally most because you aren't able to find your > braking > > > points on other tracks and don't know where to accelerate, right? Have > you > > > ever tried gpl? If so did you ever finish a lap without spinning (and > > > without full throttle fast fast fast railriding)? > > > what's the deal about racing when all you have to do is go flat out? I > > > understand you love Tally because you don't need a lot of practise or > > skill > > > to be a (offline) race winner. > > > one of the most fun aspects of racing sims is the cornering technique! > > Find > > > your braking point, don't lock up, release the brake pedal, steer in

and > > > gently apply the throttle, don't spin the wheels when exiting. > > > If you don't like that in a sim, go find you fun elsewhere and give NFS

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> > and > > > other arcade racers a try: full throttle fun and easy! I'm sure you'll > > like > > > that. > > > Ever taken a plane? A Boeing 747 goes FAST FAST FAST too, much faster > than > > a > > > dragster! Does that give you a thrill? No, because you aren't

cornering, > > > braking, accelerating... > > > F1's most boring track is Hockenheim. It's one of the fastest tracks in > > F1, > > > but drivers complain that it has to much long straights. It ain't a > > drivers > > > track. All you need is a fast car with the most topspeed. You don't need

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> > to > > > be the best driver to win there. > > > My point: everybody can accelerate and go fast! You don't need to be > > skilled > > > for that. Every wimp can do that. > > > > > Tally races are for the newbies, I guess... I've never understood > why > > > Talladega > > > > > is the most popular track. > > > > I happen to like Dega the best... Racing is NOT "hitting the > Brakes" > > > > and "Slowing down",***that, RACING is going FAST FAST FAST,

using > > > > your skills to hit the corners just right, conserve your tires, > draft... > > > > Braking is for p*$$ies who are scared to go fast ..... Thats just my > > > > opinion ... Same for Drag Racing, you don't hit the brakes till the > race > > > > is over.. You see some of us like the thrill of extream speed... I do > > > > in a sim as well as real life (I've gone 155-160 mph) ... we all have > > > > our things. > > > > scott

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> <snip> > Anyways, a couple good friends of mine who know the track in real life quite > well, one of which raced there a few times with ARCA back in the late > 80's/early 90's time period, and a wreck finished her career there, hehe > (she's fine, car isn't tho), but they pointed out there doesn't seem to be > the bump coming out of Turn 4 like the real life track has. Which is why > they called it the fabled "calamity corner" cause of all the wrecks there > that would gather up half the field sometimes in one big mess. If i'm not > mistaken, the guy that wrecked in Sundays race right there at the end and > caused it to finish under yellow, if you look at where he wrecked, was > scraping along the wall going into the front stretch. Makes me wonder if ms. > calamity corner snuck up and bit him, seeing as how he wrecked that car all > by himself, hehe.

Actually, Spencer blew a RF tire just after coming out of T4. It sent him into the wall between T4 and the start of the trioval. In watching both series, it's amazing how much better the WC drivers are, compared to the Busch drivers. The "Cup" drivers rarely "lose it" on their own. More often than not they get help from another car via a tap or air off the spoiler. I saw a few instances on Sunday where it looked like the driver had all but lost the car, but amazingly gathered it back up. These guys ARE good! But anyway, I'm off topic now...

I'm don't feel offended at all. I just wanted to make my point a little clearer. David Karr <[email hidden]> schreef in berichtnieuws 890lei$4iv$[email hidden]...

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> Okay, my message was aimed more at where the thread seemed to be heading, > and in no way was aimed at you specifically. No offense meant. > > --DK > > > "Tim Vanhee" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:DcXpogIf$GA.275@btbntsys4... > > I didn't say it was easy to win the Winston cup. > > I am talking about sims here. And I know how hard it is to win a online > race > > at Tally. > > All I'm trying to say is that it is harder to get in a car and going

fast > at > > a road course than it is on an oval. Take for example N3. Take 10rookies

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> > and 10 aces and put them together in a race. The rookies will be much > closer > > to the aces on Tally than they will be at Sears Point. > > I certainly do have a lot of respect for Nascar racers! I know Nascar > isn't > > easy! > > > > > > David Karr <[email hidden]> schreef in berichtnieuws > > 88q0q7$c3v$[email hidden]... > > > You know, I don't put much attention to Nascar and the oval racing > > business. > > > No offense meant there; it's just not my bag. I *personally* find

other > > > types of racing more interesting. But I remember when Senna waskilled > > how > > > stations and newspapers interviewed drivers all across the racing > > spectrum, > > > and they all showed that they realized it was a profound loss, and all > > > showed great respect across the racing profession--from Nascar, toIndy, > > to > > > NHRA, to whatever. That made an impression on me--I think I matured a > bit > > > as a fan. And I remember also, that when ESPN used to do those "Askthe

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> > > Driver" bits, which were often silly--I remember being absolutely > thrilled > > > to know that Ricardo Patrese likes spaghetti a lot--for their F1 > coverage, > > > that many F1 drivers (Derek Warwick, for example) said that they liked > to > > > watch Nascar. Warwick said he was a "bit of a fan of that Dale > > > Earnhardt--he seems like a tough character." > > > > > > I wonder if there's any room in this thread to simply state that > > controlling > > > a racing vehicle at it's limits (whether Nascar OR F1) demands a LOT

of

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> > > skill. I don't think there's a whole lot of room for "pussies" in > either > > > series, despite the occasional "pay-to-drive" debacle. > > > > > > Just a thought, > > > David K. > > > > > > "Tim Vanhee" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:Bu6sfH$e$GA.354@btbntsys4... > > > > Who's the wimp here? > > > > You happen to like Tally most because you aren't able to find your > > braking > > > > points on other tracks and don't know where to accelerate, right?

Have > > you > > > > ever tried gpl? If so did you ever finish a lap without spinning(and > > > > without full throttle fast fast fast railriding)? > > > > what's the deal about racing when all you have to do is go flat out?I > > > > understand you love Tally because you don't need a lot of practiseor > > > skill > > > > to be a (offline) race winner. > > > > one of the most fun aspects of racing sims is the corneringtechnique!

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> > > Find > > > > your braking point, don't lock up, release the brake pedal, steer in > and > > > > gently apply the throttle, don't spin the wheels when exiting. > > > > If you don't like that in a sim, go find you fun elsewhere and give > NFS > > > and > > > > other arcade racers a try: full throttle fun and easy! I'm sure

you'll > > > like > > > > that. > > > > Ever taken a plane? A Boeing 747 goes FAST FAST FAST too, muchfaster

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> > than > > > a > > > > dragster! Does that give you a thrill? No, because you aren't > cornering, > > > > braking, accelerating... > > > > F1's most boring track is Hockenheim. It's one of the fastest tracks > in > > > F1, > > > > but drivers complain that it has to much long straights. It ain't a > > > drivers > > > > track. All you need is a fast car with the most topspeed. You don't > need > > > to > > > > be the best driver to win there. > > > > > > > > My point: everybody can accelerate and go fast! You don't need to be > > > skilled > > > > for that. Every wimp can do that. > > > > > > > > > > > > Scotty <[email hidden]> schreef in berichtnieuws > > > > [email hidden]... > > > > > Morgan VW� wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Tally races are for the newbies, I guess... I've never

understood

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> > why > > > > Talladega > > > > > > is the most popular track. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I happen to like Dega the best... Racing is NOT "hitting the > > Brakes" > > > > > and "Slowing down", screw that, RACING is going FAST FAST FAST, > using > > > > > your skills to hit the corners just right, conserve your tires, > > draft... > > > > > Braking is for p*$$ies who are scared to go fast ..... Thats just

my > > > > > opinion ... Same for Drag Racing, you don't hit the brakes tillthe > > race > > > > > is over.. You see some of us like the thrill of extream speed...I

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> do > > > > > in a sim as well as real life (I've gone 155-160 mph) ... we all > have > > > > > our things. > > > > > > > > > > scott > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >